KAET: Native Visions

Education As in cities and towns across Arizona, education is an issue that is challenging Native American communities. This segment includes historical perspectives ranging from the Meriam Report and Kennedy Report to the Indian Education Act of 1972. Guests include: David Beaulieu, Professor and Director, Center for Indian Education, Arizona State University, and Ted Hibbler, Director of Indian Education, Phoenix Union High School District. The panel discussion in studio features: Peterson Zah, former president of the Navajo Nation, and Special Advisor to the President on Indian Affairs, Arizona State University; Vivian Juan-Saunders, Chairwoman of the Tohono O'odham Nation; Fred Ferreiri, Director of Education, San Carlos Apache Tribe. The complete transcript for the education segment on Native Visions follows: Ivan Makil: For over a century, many attempts to meet the educational needs of Indian students have been woefully inadequate. Despite numerous recommendations, legislation, and government programs, many of our children have not been provided the resources they need to make their way in the world. Reporter: The history of Indian education begins with an effort to assimilate Indian children into mainstream American society. Over the years, educators generally expected Native American students to fit into a system that was not only foreign to them, but in direct conflict with the ways of their people. David Beaulieu: They saw Indian children specifically as being without culture, being sort of empty vessels. And in order to have an influence with them, they needed to be removed from the influences of that culture, that community, the societies in which they were born, removed from the influence of their parents, particularly elderly members of their community, and taken off to go to school. Government implemented that in a lot of ways, but the major feature, of course, was the development of what was called the Indian -- the off reservation boarding school. Reporter: These schools systematically separated Indian children from their culture. Once away from their homes, their hair was cut. They were forbidden to speak their traditional languages, and their tribal identities were eliminated. David Beaulieu: The Meriam Report reacted against the idea of having a sameness across the entire curriculum all over the country. It recognized that Indian people were different in different communities. They had different cultures and so forth, and that curriculum that was uniform for all of these various communities and for all of these various individual Indian students didn't make any sense. Reporter: The report which was critical of government Indian policies overall found that no Indian School met any of the standard educational requirements. It also found that contrary to the opinion of many at the time, Indians were capable of an education and should receive all the benefits of one. But decades later, another report, which evolved out of concern for Native Americans by Senator Robert Kennedy, found that Indian education still had a long way to go. David Beaulieu: It was through his efforts that they formed what was called the Senate Subcommittee on Indian Education. And that subcommittee held its own hearings, and it ultimately moved to develop a series of -- a report, actually, and recommendations. That final report sort of set the tone, then, for what was to occur from that point. And the final report labeled Indian education a national tragedy, a national challenge. Whatever was going on there, it was not responding to the needs of Indian people, and it certainly wasn't working. Reporter: The Kennedy report found that on average, Indian students were one to two years behind their non-Indian counterparts. It also found that 60% would not graduate from high school and indeed, most were expected to fail. The report sparked renewed interest in creating reform, and several years later, the Indian Education Act of 1972 was passed. Although many innovative and worthwhile programs were generated under the Act, progress has continued to be slow. Ted Ironshell Hibbler: I think we have a long ways to go as far as academically getting our Native American students ready to enter into the work force and enter into four-year colleges and universities. Reporter: In an effort to better serve the particular educational needs of their native students, the Phoenix Union High School District offers innovative programs that are based on age-old traditions. Ted Ironshell Hibbler: In the Phoenix Union High School District, we have culture camps that we utilize to bring forward some of the social interactive styles of learning and a natural environment up in the mountains. Native people, a lot of times, learn through social interaction with their extended families. If that social interaction is brought forward from the home into the classroom, then that acquisition of knowledge of how our young people learn will be a lot more relevant to them. Consequently, they will pick things up at a quicker pace. Reporter: At Phoenix College, another innovative district program brings the Navajo language to urban students. Jennifer Wheeler: They are very excited coming into the program, and we try to do activities, you know, assignments that include family participation as well as community activities. They get a lot of the culture. We also include the government, Navajo government, in our lessons. I think offering this Navajo course serves as a very nice supplemental education. Reporter: Approximately 90% of Native American students in the United States are attending public schools, and with more Native Americans living off the reservation, an increasing number of these students will be attending schools off the reservation as well Ted Ironshell Hibbler: I think what our educators, our administrators and teachers need to understand is that they are going to be seeing more native people in their classrooms, and that these young people are coming in with sometimes different world views and different ways to learn, different ways to acquire knowledge, and they have quite a bit to offer society and the discussions in the classrooms as well. Ivan Makil: With me now to discuss the issue of Indian education is Peterson Zah, former President of the Navajo Nation and special adviser to ASU President, Michael Crow. The honorable Vivian Juan-Saunders, Chairwoman of the Tohono O'Odham Nation. And Fred Ferreira for the San Carlos Apache tribe. Welcome. Mr. Zah, the clip that we just saw, there was a great deal of discussion about boarding school. Tell us about your experience with boarding school. Peterson Zah: Well, I came in to Phoenix during the time that – the federal government had a policy that all the Indian people who were of a school age to go to the boarding schools because at that time, there were no schools on -- in the reservation on Indian land. And there were several states that were chosen by their government to construct and create Indian boarding schools. To begin with, I think a lot of people know that we had one in Pennsylvania, the Carlisle Indian School. We had the Phoenix Indian School here in Arizona. Some in Oklahoma, a couple of them in Oregon, some in Utah, and some in California. The whole idea was to get the Indian people off their land, the young people, and put them out there, and the plan was really to have them get their education and then to ultimately assimilate them into a dominant culture. That went on for several years. I'm a product of a boarding school. I went to school here in Phoenix, and depending on the students -- for me, it wasn't really a good experience. The academic achievement of Indian students was very low, because what the school was all about was trying to get rid of our culture, get rid of our tribalism. There were people who came in with long hair, and their hair had to be shortened, some shaved. You were forbidden to speak your own language, practice your own religion, some of those basic, basic things that's really, really important to the Indian people, they were being discouraged and people – the students were punished for having to resort to that to give themselves strength. Ivan Makil: Why do you think that position was taken by the boarding schools? Was it that they didn't understand? They didn't respect? Peterson Zah: I think it's a combination of those things, probably did not completely understand, and then at the same time, if you don't understand it, then you have no respect for it, but that was not the situation with the Indian people. The Indian people I think wanted that as part of their life, as part of their growing up process, and basically, many of the students that I went to school with were very resentful of that. That didn't work, boarding school system, and the Indian people then started demanding the building of their own schools back in Indian country on their own land where they could learn about their own culture, their own history, their own lifestyle. So that was pushed very, very hard, probably in the middle of the 1900s, and it was something that I think the Indian tribal leaders were really looking forward to, because the boarding schools weren't doing too good. There were students who were running away. They had some riots at some of those boarding schools, and tribal leaders just condemned the concept and decided to work in their own -- on their own reservation, begin building those schools. Ivan Makil: The system didn't work? Peterson Zah: The system did not work. Ivan Makil: The idea didn't work. We'll move this along to some of the issues and the challenges we have today. Fred Ferreira, what are some of the experiences you have to share with us about the current situation today or how it has evolved? Fred Ferriera: Well, I think there's several things. We talked a little bit about testing, the national testing, AIMS, the new system, No Child Left Behind. This is not a one-size-fits-all type of situation, and Indian tribes have uniqueness, so we have to address those issues. Part of those issues involve high poverty rates on the reservation. Families that have not had a higher education, it affects their children and the way they learn. On the reservations, teachers -- maintaining quality teachers is tough. Ivan Makil: Is that because of location? Fred Ferreira: Yeah, the location, recruiting them out to the reservation, you know, housing is an issue for us. We have to provide housing. There are not that many of these that you have like in the urban areas. So that's tough. We lose that continuity when we don't keep those teachers, especially good quality teachers. That's -- other things that we have a problem with is health issues, which, you know, the families have a whole lot of different variety of health issues from alcoholism, diabetes, you know, cancer, and the children are growing up with that, and you know, it's tough. So now you try to get them to go to school. We have a problem with attendance, absenteeism, and so many things happening at home, the children don't attend school. And of course, you know if they are not in school, they are not learning, they are missing that valuable lesson. Ivan Makil: So this issue, then, is really a much greater issue in terms of really dealing with education within a community. It's not just the issue of the educational system, or it is lack of resources is one of them, but also it's the other aspects of distances, transportation, all of those other kinds of issues? Is that – Fred Ferreira: Exactly. It's a very broad picture you look at. We can't just single out a couple little things here. It's the whole picture. It's the whole community that's going to have to deal with it. I feel that preschool is one area that we really need to look at to give those children a start. You know, we have Head Start, but Head Start does a certain part of it. Preschool will help. All-day kindergarten I believe is also important like the Governor is trying to get across. I believe that's another important stance. And if we can continue that on each grade and build upon that foundation, I think that's going to help us go a great way. Ivan Makil: So many challenges. Chairwoman Saunders, you are very familiar with many of these issues, as a matter of fact, not only a college graduate, but also a vice president of one of the community colleges. Tell us about that experience and tell us, also, if you would, about how you see this from the perspective of a tribal leader as well, because that really is important. Vivian Juan-Saunders: American Indians, like people in the State of Arizona and throughout the country, we want quality education for our children, and it's as if we're still trying to catch up for the last 200 years, and without adequate resources and despite the trust obligations that the federal government has with American Indians, we're seeing dwindling resources, especially in education, and despite the years of forced policies, the taking away of our identity, we value education today in the 21st century, and it's so important to have the adequate resources that are necessary. I view education as life-long learning, from the moment of birth to adulthood, whatever we want to pursue in life, and for the Tohono O'odham Nation, we've looked at tribal college and Tohono O'odham Community College, which over the last five years we've worked very hard to obtain accreditation, accreditation just like any other community college in this state, same requirement, same regulations. And we view tribal colleges as helping us to build Indian nations, Indian communities, and unfortunately, we're seeing dollars for tribally controlled community colleges dwindling. For example, our Head Start teachers, must become certified as a basis for No Child Left Behind. Well, we need our community college to train and to certify and to help our Head Start teachers obtain the college degrees, community college degrees, to meet the requirements of No Child Left Behind. And then as a government, we then respect the credentials that they bring to their job by increasing their salaries. And if we don't have all of the pieces in place, then, the quality of education that we want for our people, we still continue to struggle. We're never going to catch up. Ivan Makil Well, so basically what you have as a tribal leader, is you are looking and struggling to find additional revenue from your own resources as a tribal government, which you have a responsibility to provide for your people to supplement this so-called contract that we're supposed to have with the federal government. Is that accurate? Vivian Juan-Saunders: That's accurate. Not only do we have federal schools on the reservation, but because of geographic locations of our communities, our students attend school in nearby communities, and so what happens to public schools within the surrounding reservation is so important to what we do on the nation, and -- but it's taking control of our own destiny. It's identifying what we want for Indian education, for our own people, and that hasn't been the case historically, and so, I really look forward to having the adequate resources that we need, that the obligations call for. Ivan Makil: If I could ask you all, just a question or something to think about, what do you see as some of the challenges that are still out there forthcoming in the future of educating our people and what kinds of things would be helpful and also what do we hope as the ultimate outcome. I know that Chairwoman Saunders, you mentioned basically productive citizens is what I think I was hearing you say, but if I was to ask you all to have a brief response, because I know that time is short here, but if we could, brief response, if you have some thoughts about that. Vivian Juan-Saunders: I would say for the federal government and the state to increase their resources, and at the same time to allow the tribes to send many of their students to colleges and university where they get their education, cultural education, and whatever it is that the tribal people want. Educate them at those universities and then send them back over to the Indian communities and let them do their job of allowing the students to grow in their own way, learning cultural things, language and what have you, and let them be whatever it is that the tribe wants them to be. Ivan Makil: Great. Vivian Juan-Saunders: I'd like to add that the resources are very important. We're getting cut so much that it's really going to affect our tribe in particular. Right now we serve probably 125 students going off to college. However, we've got another two-thirds that we don't have funding for. So it makes it very difficult. One of the good things, though, with our local high school, one of the things that we'd like to do a little bit more on is our alternative school. We found that those students that we lose during the school year or from other schools, again like surrounding schools, they get dropouts. When we get them into our alternative school -- we had 10 more students graduate than would have graduated last year, and we'd like to continue that. But again, it's resources and funding. So we need to do more along those lines. Ivan Makil: Chairman Saunders. Vivian Juan-Saunders: It's developing productive citizens to play an important role in our economy and to bring that back to local Indian communities and to embrace our cultures, rather than taking away, and we still have our language and our songs and our philosophies today, despite all that we've gone through the last 200 years or so, and I'm very proud of that, because it makes us so strong today as we move forward in Indian education. Ivan Makil: Thank you all very much, because you all -- and I commend you all, and we're very honored to have you here today and to the leaders in the tribal communities for, again, promoting and helping our people with education. >> Read the complete transcript for this groundbreaking one-hour special, including the interview with Senator John McCain and the discussion on health care. Major funding for Native Visions provided by a grant from the Arizona State University Office of Public Affairs.	Native Visions Native American sovereignty Education Health care About the TV program Ivan Makil Profile From the General Manager Learn more about the Native American communities represented on Native Visions: The Hopi Tribe Inter-Tribal Council of Arizona Navajo Nation Salt River Pima-Maricopa Indian Community San Carlos Apache Tribe Tohono O'odham Nation Related Links Arizona State University American Indian History and Culture Center for Indian Education

Education

Education panel discussion As in cities and towns across Arizona, education is an issue that is challenging Native American communities. This segment includes historical perspectives ranging from the Meriam Report and Kennedy Report to the Indian Education Act of 1972.
Guests include:
David Beaulieu, Professor and Director, Center for Indian Education, Arizona State University, and Ted Hibbler, Director of Indian Education, Phoenix Union High School District.

The panel discussion in studio features:
Peterson Zah, former president of the Navajo Nation, and Special Advisor to the President on Indian Affairs, Arizona State University;
Vivian Juan-Saunders, Chairwoman of the Tohono O'odham Nation;
Fred Ferreiri, Director of Education, San Carlos Apache Tribe.

The complete transcript for the education segment on Native Visions follows:

Ivan Makil:
For over a century, many attempts to meet the educational needs of Indian students have been woefully inadequate. Despite numerous recommendations, legislation, and government programs, many of our children have not been provided the resources they need to make their way in the world.

Reporter:
The history of Indian education begins with an effort to assimilate Indian children into mainstream American society. Over the years, educators generally expected Native American students to fit into a system that was not only foreign to them, but in direct conflict with the ways of their people.

David Beaulieu:
They saw Indian children specifically as being without culture, being sort of empty vessels. And in order to have an influence with them, they needed to be removed from the influences of that culture, that community, the societies in which they were born, removed from the influence of their parents, particularly elderly members of their community, and taken off to go to school. Government implemented that in a lot of ways, but the major feature, of course, was the development of what was called the Indian -- the off reservation boarding school.

Reporter:
These schools systematically separated Indian children from their culture. Once away from their homes, their hair was cut. They were forbidden to speak their traditional languages, and their tribal identities were eliminated.

David Beaulieu:
The Meriam Report reacted against the idea of having a sameness across the entire curriculum all over the country. It recognized that Indian people were different in different communities. They had different cultures and so forth, and that curriculum that was uniform for all of these various communities and for all of these various individual Indian students didn't make any sense.

Reporter:
The report which was critical of government Indian policies overall found that no Indian School met any of the standard educational requirements. It also found that contrary to the opinion of many at the time, Indians were capable of an education and should receive all the benefits of one. But decades later, another report, which evolved out of concern for Native Americans by Senator Robert Kennedy, found that Indian education still had a long way to go.

David Beaulieu:
It was through his efforts that they formed what was called the Senate Subcommittee on Indian Education. And that subcommittee held its own hearings, and it ultimately moved to develop a series of -- a report, actually, and recommendations. That final report sort of set the tone, then, for what was to occur from that point. And the final report labeled Indian education a national tragedy, a national challenge. Whatever was going on there, it was not responding to the needs of Indian people, and it certainly wasn't working.

Reporter:
The Kennedy report found that on average, Indian students were one to two years behind their non-Indian counterparts. It also found that 60% would not graduate from high school and indeed, most were expected to fail. The report sparked renewed interest in creating reform, and several years later, the Indian Education Act of 1972 was passed. Although many innovative and worthwhile programs were generated under the Act, progress has continued to be slow.

Ted Ironshell Hibbler:
I think we have a long ways to go as far as academically getting our Native American students ready to enter into the work force and enter into four-year colleges and universities. Reporter: In an effort to better serve the particular educational needs of their native students, the Phoenix Union High School District offers innovative programs that are based on age-old traditions.

Ted Ironshell Hibbler:
In the Phoenix Union High School District, we have culture camps that we utilize to bring forward some of the social interactive styles of learning and a natural environment up in the mountains. Native people, a lot of times, learn through social interaction with their extended families. If that social interaction is brought forward from the home into the classroom, then that acquisition of knowledge of how our young people learn will be a lot more relevant to them. Consequently, they will pick things up at a quicker pace.

Reporter:
At Phoenix College, another innovative district program brings the Navajo language to urban students.

Jennifer Wheeler:
They are very excited coming into the program, and we try to do activities, you know, assignments that include family participation as well as community activities. They get a lot of the culture. We also include the government, Navajo government, in our lessons. I think offering this Navajo course serves as a very nice supplemental education.

Reporter:
Approximately 90% of Native American students in the United States are attending public schools, and with more Native Americans living off the reservation, an increasing number of these students will be attending schools off the reservation as well

Ted Ironshell Hibbler:
I think what our educators, our administrators and teachers need to understand is that they are going to be seeing more native people in their classrooms, and that these young people are coming in with sometimes different world views and different ways to learn, different ways to acquire knowledge, and they have quite a bit to offer society and the discussions in the classrooms as well.

An image from the program. Ivan Makil:
With me now to discuss the issue of Indian education is Peterson Zah, former President of the Navajo Nation and special adviser to ASU President, Michael Crow. The honorable Vivian Juan-Saunders, Chairwoman of the Tohono O'Odham Nation. And Fred Ferreira for the San Carlos Apache tribe. Welcome. Mr. Zah, the clip that we just saw, there was a great deal of discussion about boarding school. Tell us about your experience with boarding school.

Peterson Zah:
Well, I came in to Phoenix during the time that – the federal government had a policy that all the Indian people who were of a school age to go to the boarding schools because at that time, there were no schools on -- in the reservation on Indian land. And there were several states that were chosen by their government to construct and create Indian boarding schools. To begin with, I think a lot of people know that we had one in Pennsylvania, the Carlisle Indian School. We had the Phoenix Indian School here in Arizona. Some in Oklahoma, a couple of them in Oregon, some in Utah, and some in California. The whole idea was to get the Indian people off their land, the young people, and put them out there, and the plan was really to have them get their education and then to ultimately assimilate them into a dominant culture. That went on for several years. I'm a product of a boarding school. I went to school here in Phoenix, and depending on the students -- for me, it wasn't really a good experience. The academic achievement of Indian students was very low, because what the school was all about was trying to get rid of our culture, get rid of our tribalism. There were people who came in with long hair, and their hair had to be shortened, some shaved. You were forbidden to speak your own language, practice your own religion, some of those basic, basic things that's really, really important to the Indian people, they were being discouraged and people – the students were punished for having to resort to that to give themselves strength.

Ivan Makil:
Why do you think that position was taken by the boarding schools? Was it that they didn't understand? They didn't respect?

Peterson Zah:
I think it's a combination of those things, probably did not completely understand, and then at the same time, if you don't understand it, then you have no respect for it, but that was not the situation with the Indian people. The Indian people I think wanted that as part of their life, as part of their growing up process, and basically, many of the students that I went to school with were very resentful of that. That didn't work, boarding school system, and the Indian people then started demanding the building of their own schools back in Indian country on their own land where they could learn about their own culture, their own history, their own lifestyle. So that was pushed very, very hard, probably in the middle of the 1900s, and it was something that I think the Indian tribal leaders were really looking forward to, because the boarding schools weren't doing too good. There were students who were running away. They had some riots at some of those boarding schools, and tribal leaders just condemned the concept and decided to work in their own -- on their own reservation, begin building those schools.

Ivan Makil:
The system didn't work?

Peterson Zah: The system did not work.

Ivan Makil: The idea didn't work. We'll move this along to some of the issues and the challenges we have today. Fred Ferreira, what are some of the experiences you have to share with us about the current situation today or how it has evolved?

Fred Ferriera:
Well, I think there's several things. We talked a little bit about testing, the national testing, AIMS, the new system, No Child Left Behind. This is not a one-size-fits-all type of situation, and Indian tribes have uniqueness, so we have to address those issues. Part of those issues involve high poverty rates on the reservation. Families that have not had a higher education, it affects their children and the way they learn. On the reservations, teachers -- maintaining quality teachers is tough.

Ivan Makil:
Is that because of location?

Fred Ferreira:
Yeah, the location, recruiting them out to the reservation, you know, housing is an issue for us. We have to provide housing. There are not that many of these that you have like in the urban areas. So that's tough. We lose that continuity when we don't keep those teachers, especially good quality teachers. That's -- other things that we have a problem with is health issues, which, you know, the families have a whole lot of different variety of health issues from alcoholism, diabetes, you know, cancer, and the children are growing up with that, and you know, it's tough. So now you try to get them to go to school. We have a problem with attendance, absenteeism, and so many things happening at home, the children don't attend school. And of course, you know if they are not in school, they are not learning, they are missing that valuable lesson.

Ivan Makil:
So this issue, then, is really a much greater issue in terms of really dealing with education within a community. It's not just the issue of the educational system, or it is lack of resources is one of them, but also it's the other aspects of distances, transportation, all of those other kinds of issues? Is that –

Fred Ferreira:
Exactly. It's a very broad picture you look at. We can't just single out a couple little things here. It's the whole picture. It's the whole community that's going to have to deal with it. I feel that preschool is one area that we really need to look at to give those children a start. You know, we have Head Start, but Head Start does a certain part of it. Preschool will help. All-day kindergarten I believe is also important like the Governor is trying to get across. I believe that's another important stance. And if we can continue that on each grade and build upon that foundation, I think that's going to help us go a great way.

Ivan Makil:
So many challenges. Chairwoman Saunders, you are very familiar with many of these issues, as a matter of fact, not only a college graduate, but also a vice president of one of the community colleges. Tell us about that experience and tell us, also, if you would, about how you see this from the perspective of a tribal leader as well, because that really is important.

An image from the program Vivian Juan-Saunders:
American Indians, like people in the State of Arizona and throughout the country, we want quality education for our children, and it's as if we're still trying to catch up for the last 200 years, and without adequate resources and despite the trust obligations that the federal government has with American Indians, we're seeing dwindling resources, especially in education, and despite the years of forced policies, the taking away of our identity, we value education today in the 21st century, and it's so important to have the adequate resources that are necessary. I view education as life-long learning, from the moment of birth to adulthood, whatever we want to pursue in life, and for the Tohono O'odham Nation, we've looked at tribal college and Tohono O'odham Community College, which over the last five years we've worked very hard to obtain accreditation, accreditation just like any other community college in this state, same requirement, same regulations. And we view tribal colleges as helping us to build Indian nations, Indian communities, and unfortunately, we're seeing dollars for tribally controlled community colleges dwindling. For example, our Head Start teachers, must become certified as a basis for No Child Left Behind. Well, we need our community college to train and to certify and to help our Head Start teachers obtain the college degrees, community college degrees, to meet the requirements of No Child Left Behind. And then as a government, we then respect the credentials that they bring to their job by increasing their salaries. And if we don't have all of the pieces in place, then, the quality of education that we want for our people, we still continue to struggle. We're never going to catch up.

Ivan Makil
Well, so basically what you have as a tribal leader, is you are looking and struggling to find additional revenue from your own resources as a tribal government, which you have a responsibility to provide for your people to supplement this so-called contract that we're supposed to have with the federal government. Is that accurate?

Vivian Juan-Saunders:
That's accurate. Not only do we have federal schools on the reservation, but because of geographic locations of our communities, our students attend school in nearby communities, and so what happens to public schools within the surrounding reservation is so important to what we do on the nation, and -- but it's taking control of our own destiny. It's identifying what we want for Indian education, for our own people, and that hasn't been the case historically, and so, I really look forward to having the adequate resources that we need, that the obligations call for.

Ivan Makil:
If I could ask you all, just a question or something to think about, what do you see as some of the challenges that are still out there forthcoming in the future of educating our people and what kinds of things would be helpful and also what do we hope as the ultimate outcome. I know that Chairwoman Saunders, you mentioned basically productive citizens is what I think I was hearing you say, but if I was to ask you all to have a brief response, because I know that time is short here, but if we could, brief response, if you have some thoughts about that.

Vivian Juan-Saunders:
I would say for the federal government and the state to increase their resources, and at the same time to allow the tribes to send many of their students to colleges and university where they get their education, cultural education, and whatever it is that the tribal people want. Educate them at those universities and then send them back over to the Indian communities and let them do their job of allowing the students to grow in their own way, learning cultural things, language and what have you, and let them be whatever it is that the tribe wants them to be.

Ivan Makil:
Great.

Vivian Juan-Saunders:
I'd like to add that the resources are very important. We're getting cut so much that it's really going to affect our tribe in particular. Right now we serve probably 125 students going off to college. However, we've got another two-thirds that we don't have funding for. So it makes it very difficult. One of the good things, though, with our local high school, one of the things that we'd like to do a little bit more on is our alternative school. We found that those students that we lose during the school year or from other schools, again like surrounding schools, they get dropouts. When we get them into our alternative school -- we had 10 more students graduate than would have graduated last year, and we'd like to continue that. But again, it's resources and funding. So we need to do more along those lines.

Ivan Makil:
Chairman Saunders.

Vivian Juan-Saunders:
It's developing productive citizens to play an important role in our economy and to bring that back to local Indian communities and to embrace our cultures, rather than taking away, and we still have our language and our songs and our philosophies today, despite all that we've gone through the last 200 years or so, and I'm very proud of that, because it makes us so strong today as we move forward in Indian education.

Ivan Makil:
Thank you all very much, because you all -- and I commend you all, and we're very honored to have you here today and to the leaders in the tribal communities for, again, promoting and helping our people with education.

>> Read the complete transcript for this groundbreaking one-hour special, including the interview with Senator John McCain and the discussion on health care.

Major funding for Native Visions provided by a grant from the
Arizona State University Office of Public Affairs.