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September 9, 2004

Host: Michael Grant
Topics:
· First Thursday: The Governor on HORIZON
In-Studio Guests:
· Governor Janet Napolitano

>> Michael Grant:
Tonight on "Horizon," it was the revenge of the conservatives on primary election night several moderates drubbed out of the legislature after breaking ranks with conservative leadership. The Governor's drought plan is out and it confirms we are in a drought. The Governor says lawmakers should not get a pay raise. We'll talk about all of that, coming up on "Horizon."

>> Michael Grant:
Good evening, I'm Michael Grant. Welcome to "Horizon." It's time for our monthly visit with Governor Janet Napolitano, which we call first Thursday. Of course, sometimes it does not land on the first Thursday. We'll rename it on any given Thursday. We missed the first thirst because "Horizon" was preempted for the Republican national convention. Governor Janet Napolitano joins us tonight to talk about the primary results and more. She'll field questions E-mailed to us from viewers, including an interesting one on bats and mosquitoes. Here now is Governor Janet Napolitano. Speaking of Republican national convention --

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Yes

>> Michael Grant:
You and I agreed last month that the president was not going to get a bump out of the convention. He did. What happened?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Right. Our conventional wisdom, so to speak was incorrect. He clearly got a bump. He had a good show, and now the burden of proof, to use a lawyer term, would be on Kerry, which I believe he will be able to carry with great strength through the next 60 days. It's a tough race for everybody.

>> Michael Grant:
That republic poll indicated quite a spread in Arizona for President Bush. What does John Kerry have to do in Arizona, number one, and number two, there are some indications that Arizona has been dropped to a second tier state by the Kerry/Edwards ticket.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I think what John Kerry has to do is, number one, he went through 30 days of unmerited attacks on himself and his character and he just has to fight back. It is not right to have his Vietnam War record questioned in the way it was by people who weren't there. That's the same as questioning any medal one by any Vietnam soldier. It's just not right. And I think that's a new kind of low in politics. So he's got to fight back. And then, again, I believe that this election is about the future of our economy, of jobs, of healthcare, all of the things that really haven't been tended to in my view, over the past three years. And that's what the debate needs to be about. It doesn't need to be solely on foreign policy. I think we need to get back to what's going to affect the pocket books of the average Arizonan.

>> Michael Grant:
You've got the stories this week about President Bush's record in the National Guard in Vietnam. This is the kind of thing, I think that makes a lot of voters very displeased with the process. Why is it one way or the other that we're fighting a war that ended, I think about 29 years ago?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Right. You know, I think this -- I think both candidates ought to just say, you know what, I went to Vietnam, I didn't go to Vietnam, we all know that, that's the way it is. We are in a war in Iraq now. We need to talk about how we deal with the peace in Iraq, if we're ever going to get there. And again, we need to get back to talking about the future of the United States, of what really impacts Arizonans, jobs and healthcare and all of those sorts of things that have kind of gotten lost. We spent more time on the swift boat and National Guard records than we have, really, on the issues that concern us. And I think that depresses turnout. People turn off. And they get not interested anymore, and I think if people are talking about issues that are of relevance to voters, they turn out.

>> Michael Grant:
Well, speaking of war, are you going to be at war with the Arizona legislature next year?

>>Governor Janet Napolitano:
You know, it is what it is. I'm going to keep pushing for education. I'm going to continue to keep pushing for some of our business items that were not taken up on last year's agenda, by last year's legislature, particularly in the high tech area. We'll keep moving Arizona forward and we'll see what they do.

>> Michael Grant:
It seems to me that -- obviously, the turnout was low. Nonetheless, the people who showed up at the polls were sending a message, that listen, we don't want to overspend our income.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
We're not going to overspend it. First of all, we're not overspending our income. Our budget is a very conservative budget. We've balanced it every year. The financial bond rating houses in New York have every time they've looked at our fiscal management since I've been Governor have raised our rating or removed negative outlooks. We are conservatively managed. Even this year, we're setting aside money in the rainy day fund. When I came into office I inherited a billion dollar deficit and no rainy day fund.

>> Michael Grant:
We have used tricks, for example, the school rollover.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
You can call them tricks. I call that good money management. , the way you do when you run a large business. You've got to look at the state budget as a big business and that requires investment. It requires a certain amount of debt, and it requires a long-term business plan, and we've done all three of those things.

>> Michael Grant:
What about some of the more popular subjects that might reach your desk, more popular from the standpoint of the Republican GOP legislature? For example, a rollback in the business personal property tax? Would you expect to see that bill?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Well, they're going have to -- they can't speak out of both sides of their mouth. They can't complain on the one hand that oh, my gosh we have a structural deficit and on the other hand increase the structural deficit to the extent there is one by tax rollbacks if they don't pay for -- I mean, I think that this legislature has to be very realistic. And I will be realistic with them about where we're going and how we're going to manage our way through this. We're not quite out of the economic downfall that happened after 9/11. We've got to realize that. Although the Arizona economy is coming back, it's still a work in progress. You know, I will sit down, I will be happy to negotiate with them, any time, anywhere, any place, but there are certain things we have to do in Arizona. We have to invest in education. We have to provide basic social services for those most in need, and we have to have a good business climate.

>> Michael Grant:
All day-K can we afford the additional money?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
That's a five-year expenditure. I certainly think that we need to keep expanding. We have 10,000 children in all-day kindergarten. They are learning to read. They are learning arithmetic. They are preparing to be good, active early learners and that will pay dividends down the road. My budget will include the second year expansion of all-day kindergarten. I will demonstrate to the legislature, if they are willing to listen, how that gets paid for within our revenue structure going forward.

>> Michael Grant:
You don't think the legislature deserves a pay increase?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Well, I don't think I should get one.

>> Michael Grant:
You turned down $65,000?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I turned down the recommendation for the Governor. I know the legislature's arguments, that they work very hard. I give them that. That they deal with a big budget. I give them that. And they are good people -- I mean, most of them are there for the right reasons.

>> Michael Grant:
Uh-huh.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
But the plain fact of the matter is that what has been recommended is a very high increase in salary.

>> Michael Grant:
What was the precise recommendation?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
It was from $24,000 to $36,000, and you know, this in a year -- we have state employees we pay $24,000 a year full time and they barely got a $1,000 raise, which most of it was eaten up by health insurance. And most Arizonans, if you look at average per capita income numbers across our state, haven't gotten any real increase for a number of years. So I think we need to take some -- care of some things first.

>> Michael Grant:
Here's the argument. You've heard it a number of times, and I think it has some merit. You get what you pay for. $24,000 -- we complain about the quality of the legislature frequently, but $24,000 is difficult to get some other kinds of people to be interested in running.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I've heard that argument, but then I look at some of the people who are in the legislature and you know, that, you know, some of the people who have very lucrative other options available to them, give their time to the legislature, and to be cynical, if I might, if people are motivated by money, $36,000 is not going to be enough anyway.

>> Michael Grant:
I thought for a long time if you wanted to bump them, you ought to really bump them.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Yeah. But again, I get back to a basic fairness standpoint. State employees haven't gotten a raise for years. They didn't get raises in years when the legislature could have given them raises. So they got way behind the cost of living increase. They got way behind the county, city employees, you know, and, again, the average nonpublic employee in Arizona hasn't had a real raise in a number of years. I just think you got to deal with that first.

>> Michael Grant:
All right. You are on the presidential debate team.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Yes, I am.

>> Michael Grant:
Let's try to straighten this out. As I understand it, the domestic policy debate, number one, and the foreign policy debate, number 3, which is the one scheduled for Tempe, are secure. What the Bush Administration is talking about is maybe passing on number 2 debate. Do I have that correct?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
You have a correct understanding. The second debate is scheduled to be held at Washington University in St. Louis. It is scheduled to be a town hall type of format. These are the recommendations. There is a presidential debate commission. It recommended three presidential debates, one vice presidential debate. For the three presidential debates, the first one in Florida in, Miami, hopefully no hurricanes, but on domestic policy, the second one being the town hall. Bush team is saying we don't know if we want to do that one. And the third one is foreign policy.

>> Michael Grant:
Funding for the debate here is about a half million short. Is that any problem at this point?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Well, you know, I think that this was a big deal for Arizona, for Arizona State University, to put on a good show, the whole nation will be watching. This will be the last debate before the election. If anybody out there wants to contribute, I hope they do.

>> Michael Grant:
You went to Guaymas yesterday. I was not aware of that. And you were exploring the possibility that the port might be enlarged?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Yes, I was meeting with the Governor of Sonora. This was an outgrowth of our meeting with the Arizona-Mexico Commission. One of the projects that we are working on jointly is expansion of the port at Guaymas to be able to take more large container ships and then increasing the trade traffic from Guaymas by land, by rail, through Arizona, and to the eastern United States, and there is a huge potential there, both on the Mexican side and on the Arizona side. So we were looking at the infrastructure and some timetables and all that sort of thing.

>> Michael Grant:
One of the other things that comes to mind in relation to that subject and it's been on the drawing board for a long time is the so-called Canamex highway to create a north-south --

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Corridor

>> Michael Grant:
Through Arizona and up to Canada.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
There are projects underway right now both on the Arizona side and on the Sonora side. There is a Hoover Dam bypass underway. There are road improvements underway and a budget in Arizona for CANAMEX, the same on the Sonoran side and there is a lot of work and planning being done for the port. Our vision is it's not just a transportation corridor, but multiple modality, tourism would be another big part of it. Economic development along the corridor. So, yes, it is fast moving from talk to reality.

>> Michael Grant:
V iewer question is focused on that subject. What kind of goods could come through the port of Guaymas which was mentioned in your weekly E-mail newsletter?

>>Governor Janet Napolitano:
Well, almost any kind of good because the ships that would come into Guaymas, a lot of them would be coming from Asia and using Guaymas as an alternative port for the current port at Long Beach. Anything that comes that way you are talking hard goods, manufactured goods and cultural products.

>> Michael Grant:
There is demand for more important capability. I recently read something -- I think it was the port of Portland was becoming less and less popular. I think because of the fact that you have to use the river to get into that port.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I think you do. I think you have to come down the river there to use that port. The Long Beach port is simply oversubscribed. You have to wait. San Diego has a port. Some of the traffic ultimately will move there, but Guaymas is ideal location. The port already exists. There is room there. They are getting ready to do physical infrastructure improvements. The railroad comes right down there and it comes up through Arizona. There is a lot of potential for that Guaymas port and for Arizona.

>> Michael Grant:
Logical segue, talking about the water in the port there, we'll move to the drought.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Okay.

>> Michael Grant:
I will admit to you, I read the story and not the plan. It didn't seem to me like there was a lot of "there" there in the drought plan.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Yeah, the plan is still in its infancy. I haven't weighed in with my thoughts. They are still getting comments. But in my view, the drought plan needs to be a part of a much broader Arizona water strategy. It's not just how we deal with -- when you think of drought, and we are in a drought, 7th year, probably of a very long drought cycle, you have immediate drought issues, communities that may be running out of potable water. You have to have an emergency plan. We have that. Then this is a draft for what do we do longer term in terms of preparing for a long-term drought, getting information to communities, that sort of thing. That's basically what this plan is for. But overall, we need to be looking as a state in terms of how we use water, and how we make use of the water we have in light of the growth that we want to continue to have. That means, you know, our position on the Colorado River, and our negotiating position there with the lower basin states. It means looking at new and innovative kinds of technologies that can help us make better use of the water that we have, and again, it means addressing, really, the two different water economies we have in our state, those communities that have access to the CAP and those that do not.

>> Michael Grant:
The argument is made occasionally, although repeatedly, that maybe we reach the point where we simply can't afford the luxury of culture in Arizona. There are other places where you can grow stuff that it probably makes better sense, particularly from a water standpoint. What do you say?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I would disagree with that. I think that in the places where we have culture, Yuma County, for example, we have a plan and have good plans for water there, and agriculture remains an important part of the Arizona economy. We've got to work this out and take into account that agriculture is and will remain an important part of our economy.

>> Michael Grant:
AIMS test resorts. Tom Horne was on the show. I asked him if there was any scenario under which he could see postponing the graduation requirement from 2006 on the AIMS test results and he said no. Do you see any scenario under which you would push for another postponement of the requirement?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I'm not there yet. One of the things I'm waiting for, I want to hear from the State Board of Education. I think they are looking more deeply into the actual test results and data to see if there are any patterns we can discern about why students at one school did better than students at another school, that sort of thing. But, in my view, you know, this next go-around of testing in October, you know, if there were students who took it last spring who thought, well, this is kind of a joke and didn't take it seriously, they clearly have the message now, and we'll see whether there is an increase based on that. And then I'll tell you, we're going to need to get tutors and whatever for those students. They have to pass that test. That's the rule.

>> Michael Grant:
Tom Horne says this is not unlike, I believe the two states where Florida and Massachusetts, that had very heavy fail rates a couple of years out, but by the time they hit the test, it was down to a 10% fail rate. I still wonder, though, if 10% is politically palatable.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I don't know about politically, but I have always been opposed to a single high stakes test.

>> Michael Grant:
You don't like the high stakes test.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
There are many ways you evaluate a student, grades, performance on several tests. You know, these kids are going to take SATs and ACTs and so forth. There are lots of different ways to evaluate a student and pushing the whole diploma onto one test I've always opposed.

>> Michael Grant:
I want to because I don't get to the viewer questions. We've got two more. Our second viewer question ties in bats and mosquitoes in one neat package. I write concerning our bat population, while spraying for mosquitoes continues in the Phoenix valley, as mosquitoes and other potentially affected insects account for a significant portion of the diet of bats, how will the reduction in insect numbers affect the food supply and therefore the health of our bats?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
You just want to see how much I know, don't you? Okay. Here's the answer to this question, I believe. As I understand the larvacide that is being sprayed, it attacks very small insects. From what I understand, what bats eat, they eat larger insects. What is being sprayed should not be affecting the food chain or the kind of insects that the bats eat. The bats will be okay.

>> Michael Grant:
You went to law school at the University of Virginia?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I did indeed. It's amazing what you learn, huh? But, no, seriously that is my understanding, that these are very, very tiny insects and the larva is targeted by the spray and bats eat the larger insects.

>> Michael Grant:
As you know, the presiding Judge Campbell believe has refused to issue the grand jury report. Is that an appropriate decision by Judge Campbell

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
I'm not going to comment on that. There has been an appeal. That's been threatened. I have said from the beginning if the legislature wanted to explore the prison standoff they should do so in a public setting. They have a joint committee on corrections. We offered to do public hearings. They could have had any document. It would have been made available to them. To use a grand jury for what should have been a public investigation was wrong. The grand jury is a -- it's designed to be secret, and those of us -- I mean, remember, I come out of a prosecution background. I dealt with grand juries.

>> Michael Grant:
Some concern about star chambers, as I recall.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
And grand juries, you don't get a full explanation of the evidence. You get the prosecutor's point of view, and you have to be very careful with the powers of a grand jury. Again, I have no problem with ultimately the report is made public, if Colin Campbell, Judge Campbell's ruling is reversed, you know, so be it, but I think his decision was penned on traditional grand jury law. Grand jury law is it's secret.

>> Michael Grant:
You have asked Justice Zlacket to look at the same subject, but we haven't heard anything.

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Right, and I don't know when we will hear. I haven't given him a deadline, but I asked him specifically to look at -- not the events leading up to the standoff, but the actual conduct of the negotiations to end it.

>> Michael Grant:
Okay, so it's not as perhaps as comprehensive as the entire episode, just the negotiations?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Right, because you remember we had a blue ribbon panel which comprehensively went through all of the events leading to the crisis, and since they gave us their report, which was public and their hearings were public, but since that happened, we've been in the business of implementing their recommendations.

>> Michael Grant:
Almost out of time, but I want to touch on there is a final viewer question, and basically the upshot is, what can be done to curb the pace of health insurance premium growth?

>> Governor Janet Napolitano:
Oh, I don't know if I can answer that quickly, but I think maybe next time we ought to talk about it, because there are some things we're doing at the state level through something called health care group to help small businesses with their health insurance issues.

>> Michael Grant:
Governor Janet Napolitano, thank you very much. We'll see you next month on some Thursday.

>>Governor Janet Napolitano: Some Thursday.

>> Michael Grant:
And an exhibit show indicating the richness of beauty of the Mexican art museum. It details the intricate work and creative skill of Mexican artisans reflecting Mexican culture and way of life at large. It will be at the museum until September 26th. Here's a look at that unique exhibit.

>> Reporter Larry Lemmons:
It's more than an exhibit of ceramics, metals, wood fibers and textiles. More than 400 objects by 150 of Mexico's greatest living folk artists represent an attempt to share Mexican culture and ensure the survival of great artists and tradition. The art is evident in every piece. When you are seeing such impeccable craftsmanship, how do you choose which piece to add to the collection.

>> Candida Fernandez:
The stronger ones, the most beautiful ones, the piece that talks to you and say a little more than other ones.

>> Reporter Larry Lemmons:
Those are the ones that now have a home in the collection and have paused in their voyage across the country to rest in Phoenix. Carved wood, ceramics and pieces of metal create a window from which to view our neighbor's artistic traditions.

>> Karen Hodges:
These are the best living artists, and Mexico has a long-standing folk art tradition, and it is one of the -- what I call one of the touchstones of Mexican culture, and what better than to have the opportunity to bring it to the Arizona public and to have them enjoy it as much as we do.

>> Reporter Larry Lemmons:
Metal work artisans work with copper, wrought iron, tin and led to create decorative as well as utilitarian objects. The creation of traditional clothing began before the loom, but each piece gives a glimpse into Mexican life. Woodworking techniques show the work of the Master's. Working with plant fibers, art artisans use traditional techniques to create baskets to help in daily chores.

>> Candida Fernandez:
We want to show many things. We want to show the beauty of the pieces, the art that they have, maybe first choice, but we want to know and to show how is the life in Mexico? Behind us, in the back, you can see a funeral. It's a very happy funeral. Maybe it's very complicated expression of the death, because they are laughing and it's colorful, but it's a way to see the death in Mexico, the daily view of the death.

>> Reporter Larry Lemmons:
The richness and vitality of Mexico, you can tell, does come through. But there is much more.

>> Karen Hodges:
I think by looking at the pieces that you can tell that these things are made with love and devotion and they are also for many communities and many artists, a way of making a living.

>> Michael Grant:
If you would like to see a transcript of tonight's show, see what's coming up on "Horizon," please visit the web site, www.kaet.asu.edu, click on "Horizon" in the lower left of the screen. That will lead you to all you need to know about the program.

>> Reporter Larry Lemmons:
Tuesday night was a big night for conservative Republicans in Arizona. It was nearly a clean sweep over moderates in the primary election. Join us Friday at 7:00 for the Journalists' Roundtable on "Horizon" as we look at the results and what they may mean for November.

>> Michael Grant:
Thanks very much for joining us on this Thursday evening. I'm Michael Grant. Hope to see you tomorrow. Take care. Good night. .

 

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