Horizon, Host: Ted Simons

May 5, 2008


Host: Ted Simons

Barbara Orbison

  |   Video
  • A conversation with the widow of rock n roll icon Roy Orbison, who produced Roy Orbison & Friends: A Black and White Night, one of the most successful shows seen on PBS,
Guests:
  • Lucy Mason - State Representative
  • Barrett Marson - Spokeman, State House Republicans
  • John Loredo - Political consultant, Tequida and Gutierrez


View Transcript
>>Ted Simons:
Tonight on "Horizon": State legislation is being considered that could make an environmental impact. Issues at the State Legislature and upcoming elections are confronted by our political antagonists in "One-On-One". And a conversation with the widow of Roy Orbison about one of PBS's most popular shows. That's next, on "Horizon".

>>Announcer:
"Horizon" is made possible by contributions from the Friends of Eight, members of your Arizona PBS station. Thank you.

>>Ted Simons:
Good evening, and welcome to "Horizon". I'm Ted Simons. The Arizona Republic reported recently that environmental bills are given a low priority in the State Legislature. Despite the less than perfect focus on environmental issues locally, the term "sustainability" seems to have taken the national media by storm. The primary difference between the old "environmental" label and the new one, "sustainability", is that the latter takes into account the input of business and economic concerns necessary to make real changes in the way we live. With that in mind, we take a look at three bills sponsored by Representative Lucy Mason of Prescott. Thank you so much for joining us here on "Horizon".

>>Lucy Mason:
Thank you so much, Ted.

>>Ted Simons:
Before we look at these bills' specifics here, and get into them, why you and why this issue?

>>Lucy Mason:
You know, I've been very interested in how we grow here in Arizona. I've been a legislator for six years now. And I got very interested in the electricity needs that we're trying to serve this growth. And how do we do that? You know, where do we purchase our power from? And when we have certain things like a fact of 250,000 people move into the State roughly a year - in the past, that's what we've experienced. Right now, we have 193,000 people who have moved into this State. Even with the downturn, we're still growing. Where does the electricity come from? And how do we provide that? I've been very interested in how we have such wonderful new technologies now, and how can we use those in Arizona? And how can we use what we have, which is the Sun? So I got very excited and talked with the utilities. They were kind of asking very similar questions. With our growth, where are we going to purchase our power from next? For example, we're spending billions of dollars - and $1 billion a year, I hear, from APS - from purchasing power from out of state. Why not build our power, generate our power and manufacture those implements we need to build those generation stations here in Arizona? So it's all in the how.

>>Ted Simons:
Yeah. There are a lot of "hows" here. There's a lot of stuff going on here, including something called performance contracting. Without getting too deeply into this, in general, what are we talk about here?

>>Lucy Mason:
What this allows is schools and public buildings to be able to purchase energy-efficient products, systems, and then enter into this contract and allow them to pay back the costs of the product through their savings. Because we found that there's tremendous savings by getting into energy efficiencies. Whether it's buildings, whether it's building green, whether it's using energy-efficient "Energy Star", if you will, products and systems, it's a tremendous savings overall in utility bills.

>>Ted Simons:
Is there enough savings there to go ahead and pay for something like this?

>>Lucy Mason:
Oh, there is. And it depends on the size of the system, it depends on the longevity of the contract. But by and large, you can end up saving a tremendous amount of money on utility bills. Of course I'm very interested in that, because of the revenues that - we're dealing with a revenue shortage, we're dealing with with the State Budget deficit right now.

>>Ted Simons:
Another aspect of this one particular bill, 2766, is the vehicle idling requirements. I think we all have walked past idling buses and trucks and gone, "gee, that doesn't seem like the right thing to do". If you want to change it, how do you enforce something like that?

>>Lucy Mason:
Well, what we're trying to do is recognize that we have commercial trucks that have to keep going. I mean, we're dealing with extreme temperatures which we do here in Arizona all the time, whether in Flagstaff being cold, or down here in Maricopa County, when we're at the peak of our heat in the summer. We've got to allow these cabs of these trucks to be able to idle and to be able to keep cool or keep warm, depending on where we are in the State, for commercial use. And so - there's a list, they get a pass because they've got to be able to stay in business. But what we didn't want to do was for tourism. If there were, you know, people traveling through the State and they get into Flagstaff and they're parked overnight, you know, and it's very cold, you know, they need to be able to idle to heat their vehicles. And so, we want to make sure - But the main thing, though, is that the "5-Minute Rule", which is in the bill, we're looking at schools and school districts, and how the school buses are idling. There's a very simple thing that they can do, and it doesn't take an enforcement code or a mandate from the State. The school district can take care of this and just simply turn it off, turn off the engine if they're idling, if they're going to be idling longer than five minutes.

>>Ted Simons:
OK. Other aspects of this bill. Energy-efficiency standards for all sorts of things up to and including pool pumps.

>>Lucy Mason:
We go real big, and then we go down to this. Well, we found that the pool pumps really do use a tremendous amount of electricity. And by and large as an appliance, if you will, we needed to look at how we can use something that is more efficient. And so, we used the standards that are out there, and probably will be implemented by the Federal Government at some point. So we'll just be a little bit ahead of the game.

>>Ted Simons:
There are a lot of thing in this bill. I know one of the criticisms coming from fellow lawmakers was that there's too much in the bill. It's too broad. Your response.

>>Lucy Mason:
My response to that has been, "let me sit down and visit with you. I can help you understand this bill." When you read through legal language, you can have the simplest intent and the simplest reason for having that bill, but legal language will make it sound very, very complicated. And so, when people come to me and they say this, I just say, "let me help you understand this bill". And I've done that. I've taken staff with me, and we've gone in ,and gone one by one, over each one of the provisions in the bill. And it becomes pretty simple pretty quick. For example, one of my colleagues once I did that with him, and he said, "oh, well, I can support this."

>>Ted Simons:
Interesting. OK.

>>Lucy Mason:
And that was one of my biggest opponents actually to the bill.

>>Ted Simons:
If only they were all that easy. House Bill 2615: issuing permits for solar photovoltaic systems. Is there a problem with issuing those permits now?

>>Lucy Mason:
You know, what we wanted to do was "incentivize" for building and for growth. And I understand that we're going to have building and growth anyway. Why not bring in - how can we make it as simple as possible to bring in the energy efficiency building techniques and technologies and processes that we have now for green buildings, for energy-efficient products and that sort of thing? But we were mainly focusing on how do we get - bring - because LEED is an example that we use in the bill as a standard. And, you know, it's fairly well-known across the country. It's written into Federal Law. And it's a way to build efficient, it's a way to reduce electricity usage, and to conserve. It's all about reducing power usage and water. So, by these new techniques that we have, how could we create a more efficient way to get that through the building permitting process? And that was what this bill was about. Simplest possible way.

>>Ted Simons:
Gotcha. And 2416 now extends property tax incentives. Similarly now, this would be for - not necessarily for land, but for buildings or vice versa?

>>Lucy Mason:
for buildings, for the property. This is already in law. And last year, I extended that law to - from 2011 to 2020. But 2020 isn't long enough, so what we did was we - we extended it out to 2040. And this is for financial certainty, you know. The financial institutions need to have that certainty when they're issuing bonds and loans and that sort of thing.

>>Ted Simons:
Taken as a whole, everything we talked about tonight, it sound as though this is a way to tell companies, to tell those around the country, "hey, we're on the ball here". Is that what your doing?

>>Lucy Mason:
Yes. Absolutely, Ted. We have about 5 billion - well, $5.9 billion of projects and corporations that are out there looking at us right now, waiting to go see what happens with this package of bills. They want to move to Arizona, they recognize that we've got the right population base, we have the right education system with our universities and community colleges for work force, for professionals. We have the right - I mean, we have all the Sun. And we have the right mechanisms except for the policies in place. And one of those is the property tax, major issue and stumbling block. If we don't get - I've got a -

>>Ted Simons:
Well, actually I think we pretty much got to get going here. It sounds as if all this address that particular concern, and we may have to ask you back to find out how it turns out.

>>Lucy Mason:
Well, I hope you do. That would be wonderful. Thank you so much.

>>Ted Simons:
And thank you for joining us on "Horizon".

>>Ted Simons:
Now for our regular Monday feature focusing on issues of concern to those watching the State Legislature and upcoming elections. Two political types go one on one. Tonight, Barrett Marson, the State House Republican Spokesman, goes head to head with John Loredo, a political consultant with Tequida and Gutierrez.

>>Barrett Marson:
Good evening, John.

>>John Loredo:
Hello.

>>Barrett Marson:
Happy Cinco de Mayo, and we probably have a little bit of a smaller audience tonight, and those that are out drinking can drink a little bit more, thanks to the veto that Governor Janet Napolitano issued on some stiff DUI penalties that the Legislature passed last week, since the show last aired. The Governor took out her veto stamp on a bill that increased penalties for Extreme DUI, that changed - that fixed sort of a little screw up in state law, and increased boating under the influence. All great changes that were needed, and the Governor didn't see fit to sign that bill. I mean, is she siding with drunk drivers here, John?

>>John Loredo:
Well, I think the reality is that it also reduced the interlock device time from 12 months to six months --

>>Barrett Marson: Sure.

>>John Loredo:
Which I think, you know, I mean, I think the real issue - part of the rub on this bill is -

>>Barrett Marson:
That it was sponsored by House Speaker Jim Weiers. That's what you were about to say, is that right? It's sponsored by Speaker Weiers.

>>John Loredo:
Well, no, the people who took it to Speaker Weiers was the alcohol industry. I mean, these are the folks that are always opposed to increasing fines, because they want to sell their product regardless of the social consequences of drinking and driving.

>>Barrett Marson:
But here's the thing about - here's the thing. Here's where that whole thing just melts - is you've got the whole reason why you could even limit your time on the interlock device, which is something you have to blow into everytime you start your car or when you're driving, is if you changed your behavior - you went to alcohol treatment, stayed off alcohol or, you know, reasonably there, you didn't violate the interlock device limits. If you did that for six months, you then could lower the time that you had the interlock, because you've changed your behavior. You're no longer a threat. And isn't that the point?

>>John Loredo:
Hey, I commend the Republican caucuses for finally coming to the realization and having the epiphany that treatment is a legitimate substitute for hard time behind bars.

>>Barrett Marson:
So leave it to the Democrat Governor to veto it, then?

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is it took a member of the Republican caucus to get busted on a DUI for them to have this epiphany to begin with, and -

>>Barrett Marson:
No, that's not true.

>>John Loredo:
Unfortunately -

>>Barrett Marson:
That's not true.

>>John Loredo: -
That whole concept of treatment vs. time behind bars isn't going to transfer over to any other crime except this.

>>Barrett Marson:
OK.

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is that it reduced the amount of time that a person would have to blow into that interlock device -

>>Barrett Marson:
Only based on treatment -

>>John Loredo: -
to six months.

>>Barrett Marson:
Only based on treatment and staying off alcohol, and it was vetoed. And now - another bill that was vetoed was the Sanctuary City Bill as well, that said police - local police officers were asked to cooperate with ICE agents, federal agents, when it came time to arresting people who maybe had suspicious citizenship status. And that bill was also vetoed. I really don't understand how the Governor can say, "look, we've got to get everybody involved, we've got to clamp down on the border", and veto such a simple bill like this that had no cost to local governments. Because in the bill it specifically said the Federal Government will pay for it, and if they don't, the State will.

>>John Loredo:
But that's a cost. The reality is that estimate for this bill, if the local governments, cities and towns and counties wouldn't paid for it, it's going to cost up to $130 million. There was no appropriation -

>>Barrett Marson:
That is, by the way, a figment of someone's imagination.

>>John Loredo: -
There was no appropriations attached to this bill, and the reality is that when you leave an open-ended funding mandate like that on the general fund, you know, there's a term for that that we like to use. It's called the "Alt-Fuels" kind of fund. When you even open the tabs-

>>Barrett Marson:
So, you're saying law enforcement is "Alt-Fuels"? You know, we have - the Governor sends

>>John Loredo: -
Paying the tabs for this training would have been an open tab.

>>Barrett Marson:
The Governor said - you're saying that training law enforcement is like wasting money in "Alt-Fuels" -

>>John Loredo:
I didn't, I didn't say that.

>>Barrett Marson:
But the problem is - the problem here is you've got the law enforcement, who want to do something, you've got - it costs a lot of money to house illegal immigrants in our prisons, in our State prisons. This would have been a way to cut back those costs, and a simple way to do it. When someone's arrested, you call - you check the -

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is, in any law enforcement agency in the State of Arizona, when somebody is arrested for a crime, their immigration status is checked. That's the way that it goes. So, the reality is that local law enforcement and local communities need to determine how they enforce these immigration laws, and it's best left up to them.

>>Barrett Marson:
Yea, don't worry about the law again.

>>John Loredo:
We also had a bill recently that was one of Russell Pearce's bills to attack Hispanic student organizations in the State. It was very disturbing to me to see the House Appropriations Committee talk about this bill, because there was absolute lie after absolute lie from people at the podium testifying on this bill that had everything from outrageous statements about Hispanic student organizations teach Hispanic students to murder White people.

>>Barrett Marson:
You know -

>>John Loredo: -
Just absolutely ridiculous ,and very offensive, quite frankly, to Hispanic citizens and people all over the place who are very productive, who have been involved in these Hispanic organizations that teach American values and are very, very committed to American values.

>>Barrett Marson:
The bill's really a response to some of the stories that have come out in the "Arizona republic" attacking -

>>John Loredo:
Well, stories, stories.

>>Barrett Marson: -
attacking the Raza Program down in TUSC: Tucson Unified School District. And that's - the bill was meant to target that very secretive program. 'Cause remember, even Tom Horne -

>>John Loredo:
But that's not a secretive program.

>>Barrett Marson: -
Tom Horne tried to get information, and the Superintendent of Public Instruction here in Arizona could not, he was rebuffed. And so, this was an attempt to -

>>John Loredo:
But those meetings are open to anyone who walks in.

>>Barrett Marson:
But those - no, they're not open. No, no, they are not open to anybody who walks in.

>>John Loredo:
They are absolutely open, Barrett.

>>Barrett Marson:
And so, no - well, apparently everyone then, except Tom Horne, our Superintendent of Public Instruction. So this bill -

>>John Loredo:
He's probably afraid to go to a school with a bunch of Hispanic students.

>>Barrett Marson:
Well, I think that's a bad thing to say about Tom Horne. I don't think it's true at all.

>>John Loredo:
He's a wonderful guy, whose lowballing the ELL, by the way.

>>Barrett Marson:
And so -

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is that there are a lot of people, including Legislators - I mean, I was sitting there the day that that happened. I was sitting there watching a news a story about some of the National Guard people coming back from Afghanistan. And I'm looking at that thing, and they wind up interviewing one of the students that was in one of those organizations with me ,who was draped in the American Flag, having just served his country. Very extremely offensive at a time when John McCain is trying to reach out to Hispanics.

>>Barrett Marson:
Yea. I'm not sure. Maybe - I'm not sure if the bill is the correct answer. But that's what it was trying to address. Now, what the Legislature is trying to address, though, is the 2009 State Budget. It went from 1.6 to $2 billion in the hole. And you're seeing those kind of talks continue right now. I know that you perceive it as a stalemate, and you raise that as an issue. I just don't understand because the Governor made a proposal. The Governor issued a proposal. Now, it's up to the Republicans to counter-offer, and that's exactly what we're now going through, is a counter-offer. If it's taking too long for you, I'm sorry, but this is not a stalemate. This is not coming up with - what is the Republican response? It's not -

>>John Loredo:
Part of the issue here is that I remember sitting here at the beginning of the Legislative Session, when we talked about, you know, we're going to take the first two weeks of session, and we're gonna to fix the '08 budget, and we're gonna move right into the '09. Here we are five months later, four months later, and we're barely ending the '08.

>>Barrett Marson:
And if the Governor had just agreed - and if the Governor had just agreed with what the Republicans had put on the table long before, we would have done it. Because that's exactly what happened. So - but I'm sure we'll see each other in a couple of weeks, and we can talk about the same thing again, John.

>>Ted Simons:
Recently, ASU's Center for Film, Media and Popular Culture honored Roy Orbison with a posthumous Lifetime Achievement Award. It was given to his widow, Barbara Orbison, who was also his manager. She received an award from ASU as well, honoring her work maintaining the Orbison musical legacy since his death in 1988. She was also the producer of one of the most successful programs ever on PBS, "Roy Orbison and Friends, A Black and White Night." Larry Lemmons spoke with Orbison before the ceremony.

[music]

>>Roy Orbison
(Singing): Sweet dreams baby. Sweet dreams baby. Sweet dreams baby. How long must I dream?

>>Larry Lemmons:
This particular show: The Black and White Concert by Roy Orbison might be the highest-pledged program on PBS.

>>Barbara Orbison:
It's the highest pledge, and I guess the longest pledge. It's been an incredible marriage between PBS and the show called "Black and White Night of Roy Orbison and Friends" because without the friends -

>>Larry Lemmons:
You say without the friends. But I have to say, you know, he wouldn't have had those friends were it not for his talent. And that's what really makes it incredible, I think, for pbs audiences, is seeing how well-respected he was among his colleagues at the time.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Yea.

>>Larry Lemmons:
Do you remember when that happened?

>>Barbara Orbison:
Yes. I actually helped produce it, and it sort of was my idea as a gift to Roy, a timeless gift to Roy. I wanted it to be black and white, and I wanted everybody to be dressed in a certain way. And the audience, too, so that viewers in 100 years couldn't say, "oh, that was done because of this technical support, like color". So even "The Boss": Bruce Springsteen, I don't think he ever worn a suit onstage, you know. And he said, "no problem". He put on that suit.

>>Larry Lemmons:
You didn't have any difficulty, I would imagine, getting any of those people to do this.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, everybody was really kind and supportive. But some of the players had to change because their dates moved. Like when you have a show like that. But overall, it was like one telephone call and a commitment.

>>Larry Lemmons:
I think it was the first time, too, in a really widespread forum, that people got to see Roy Orbison's talent. I mean, you got to see a lot of the things that he had done. I think a lot of people didn't realize he had been so influential over all those years.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, you know, your question saying that lots of people don't really know that Roy maybe wrote all those songs, or had all those hits, is because in those days, you know, you didn't have television to support you. So you would hear a radio, that lonesome voice somewhere that would sing "Crying" or "Only The Lonely" or "Blue Angel" or "Pretty Woman." But lots of people didn't even have the face to it. And then Roy had an universal career, meaning that he would tour here with Patsy Cline or the Beach Boys, and he would get on the plane, and tour in Australia with the Rolling Stones. And England, you know, the first tour with The Beatles, that's all so much history now. So Roy just never stayed long enough, I think, to really get like a continuous branding, as they call it today, with the voice and the voice. But then, of course, once you have see him with the glasses and that voice, I don't think you ever would forget him, you know?

>>Larry Lemmons:
He really had something of a resurgence. Well, I have to admit that, you know, I - of course I had heard these songs in the past, but - you may not like this, but when I saw "Blue Velvet", David Lynch's film and I saw Dean Stockwell singing "Candy Colored Clown", it was just so sinister, but I saw that song in such a different way - it didn't ruin the song for me, I love that song, but it made it more haunting. And put within that context, for some reason, I think for some reason, so many people heard that voice, that ethereal voice, and forgot just how haunting it was and just how wonderful it was. Can you talk about how that resurgence kind of happened in the 80's also? And then suddenly, he was much more visible than he had been in the past.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, I think there was lots of - Roy really designed his life very much like he designed the glasses, and the way he looked. And I think there's something not to be confused, and that is the personal life of the artist, and the career. And Roy separated those two so well. There was never a Roy Orbison record in our house. I never really listened to the recording 'till after Roy died. I knew the live versions of the songs. There never was like a billboard. There was nothing in our house that really - unless you would go into the studio part, where you would see the guitars and tapes and everything like that. But the other side of Roy's life was completely - he was a totally normal person, but couldn't live without music. And in the 80s, in the middle 80s, actually, around '84-'85, he decided to go one more time for it, and he did. And it was effortless, you know? Of course, you know, like David putting the song "Blue Velvet", and "Dreams in Blue Velvet", and I will forever thank David, wherever he might be. And then he had the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame induction. He did the Black and White Night, he finished an album called "Mystery Girl."

>>Larry Lemmons:
And The Traveling Wilburys.

>>Barbara Orbison:
And then The Traveling Wilburys. And so, and that all was very effortless. One thing came after the other. It was just like - and it wasn't necessarily designed. It wasn't like he said "I'm armed with a management team", and say this is what I want to do. But he had one wish, and that was, he said, "I want to be in the charts again." He said, "I love being applauded by everybody, but I want to be in the charts." And that's what he was. You know, Bono came forward to do "Mystery Girl", "A Love So Beautiful", or "Blues" for The Black and White Night." And by the time "Mystery Girl" came out, and The Traveling Willberries, he was right in the charts with everybody. So that's to personal life. And then you have a career.

>>Larry Lemmons:
What kind of person was he? Who was Roy Orbison to you? Your husband.

>>Barbara Orbison:
He was - he was just a hell of a nice guy. He was born that way. I always say he was calm and sweet. He just came one way, and that was he was a kind, kind heart. He was really, really smart. Really bright. Loved to laugh. I mean, probably 85\% of a day with him was spent in laughter about something. He was very fast-footed, you know.

>>Larry Lemmons:
Barbara Orbison, thanks so much for talking to Horizon.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Thank you.

>>Roy Orbison
(Singing): Sweet dreams baby, you can make my dreams come true.

>>Ted Simons:
Tomorrow on "Horizon", Arizona Attorney General Terry Goddard joins us to discuss investigations and prosecutions of polygamy-related crimes in our State, and talk about his plans to co-host a Town Hall on media and polygamy.

>>Ted Simons:
That's it for now. Thank you so much for joining us. I'm Ted Simons. You have a great evening.

>>Announcer:
If you have comments about "Horizon", please contact us at the addresses listed on the screen. Your name and comments may be used on a future edition of "Horizon".

>>Announcer:
"Horizon" is made possible by contributions from the Friends of Eight, members of your Arizona PBS station. Thank you.

One on One

  |   Video
  • Barrett Marson, House GOP spokesman, and political consultant John Loredo of Tequida and Guttierez debate issues at the legislature.
Guests:
  • Lucy Mason - State Representative
  • Barrett Marson - Spokeman, State House Republicans
  • John Loredo - Political consultant, Tequida and Gutierrez


View Transcript
>>Ted Simons:
Tonight on "Horizon": State legislation is being considered that could make an environmental impact. Issues at the State Legislature and upcoming elections are confronted by our political antagonists in "One-On-One". And a conversation with the widow of Roy Orbison about one of PBS's most popular shows. That's next, on "Horizon".

>>Announcer:
"Horizon" is made possible by contributions from the Friends of Eight, members of your Arizona PBS station. Thank you.

>>Ted Simons:
Good evening, and welcome to "Horizon". I'm Ted Simons. The Arizona Republic reported recently that environmental bills are given a low priority in the State Legislature. Despite the less than perfect focus on environmental issues locally, the term "sustainability" seems to have taken the national media by storm. The primary difference between the old "environmental" label and the new one, "sustainability", is that the latter takes into account the input of business and economic concerns necessary to make real changes in the way we live. With that in mind, we take a look at three bills sponsored by Representative Lucy Mason of Prescott. Thank you so much for joining us here on "Horizon".

>>Lucy Mason:
Thank you so much, Ted.

>>Ted Simons:
Before we look at these bills' specifics here, and get into them, why you and why this issue?

>>Lucy Mason:
You know, I've been very interested in how we grow here in Arizona. I've been a legislator for six years now. And I got very interested in the electricity needs that we're trying to serve this growth. And how do we do that? You know, where do we purchase our power from? And when we have certain things like a fact of 250,000 people move into the State roughly a year - in the past, that's what we've experienced. Right now, we have 193,000 people who have moved into this State. Even with the downturn, we're still growing. Where does the electricity come from? And how do we provide that? I've been very interested in how we have such wonderful new technologies now, and how can we use those in Arizona? And how can we use what we have, which is the Sun? So I got very excited and talked with the utilities. They were kind of asking very similar questions. With our growth, where are we going to purchase our power from next? For example, we're spending billions of dollars - and $1 billion a year, I hear, from APS - from purchasing power from out of state. Why not build our power, generate our power and manufacture those implements we need to build those generation stations here in Arizona? So it's all in the how.

>>Ted Simons:
Yeah. There are a lot of "hows" here. There's a lot of stuff going on here, including something called performance contracting. Without getting too deeply into this, in general, what are we talk about here?

>>Lucy Mason:
What this allows is schools and public buildings to be able to purchase energy-efficient products, systems, and then enter into this contract and allow them to pay back the costs of the product through their savings. Because we found that there's tremendous savings by getting into energy efficiencies. Whether it's buildings, whether it's building green, whether it's using energy-efficient "Energy Star", if you will, products and systems, it's a tremendous savings overall in utility bills.

>>Ted Simons:
Is there enough savings there to go ahead and pay for something like this?

>>Lucy Mason:
Oh, there is. And it depends on the size of the system, it depends on the longevity of the contract. But by and large, you can end up saving a tremendous amount of money on utility bills. Of course I'm very interested in that, because of the revenues that - we're dealing with a revenue shortage, we're dealing with with the State Budget deficit right now.

>>Ted Simons:
Another aspect of this one particular bill, 2766, is the vehicle idling requirements. I think we all have walked past idling buses and trucks and gone, "gee, that doesn't seem like the right thing to do". If you want to change it, how do you enforce something like that?

>>Lucy Mason:
Well, what we're trying to do is recognize that we have commercial trucks that have to keep going. I mean, we're dealing with extreme temperatures which we do here in Arizona all the time, whether in Flagstaff being cold, or down here in Maricopa County, when we're at the peak of our heat in the summer. We've got to allow these cabs of these trucks to be able to idle and to be able to keep cool or keep warm, depending on where we are in the State, for commercial use. And so - there's a list, they get a pass because they've got to be able to stay in business. But what we didn't want to do was for tourism. If there were, you know, people traveling through the State and they get into Flagstaff and they're parked overnight, you know, and it's very cold, you know, they need to be able to idle to heat their vehicles. And so, we want to make sure - But the main thing, though, is that the "5-Minute Rule", which is in the bill, we're looking at schools and school districts, and how the school buses are idling. There's a very simple thing that they can do, and it doesn't take an enforcement code or a mandate from the State. The school district can take care of this and just simply turn it off, turn off the engine if they're idling, if they're going to be idling longer than five minutes.

>>Ted Simons:
OK. Other aspects of this bill. Energy-efficiency standards for all sorts of things up to and including pool pumps.

>>Lucy Mason:
We go real big, and then we go down to this. Well, we found that the pool pumps really do use a tremendous amount of electricity. And by and large as an appliance, if you will, we needed to look at how we can use something that is more efficient. And so, we used the standards that are out there, and probably will be implemented by the Federal Government at some point. So we'll just be a little bit ahead of the game.

>>Ted Simons:
There are a lot of thing in this bill. I know one of the criticisms coming from fellow lawmakers was that there's too much in the bill. It's too broad. Your response.

>>Lucy Mason:
My response to that has been, "let me sit down and visit with you. I can help you understand this bill." When you read through legal language, you can have the simplest intent and the simplest reason for having that bill, but legal language will make it sound very, very complicated. And so, when people come to me and they say this, I just say, "let me help you understand this bill". And I've done that. I've taken staff with me, and we've gone in ,and gone one by one, over each one of the provisions in the bill. And it becomes pretty simple pretty quick. For example, one of my colleagues once I did that with him, and he said, "oh, well, I can support this."

>>Ted Simons:
Interesting. OK.

>>Lucy Mason:
And that was one of my biggest opponents actually to the bill.

>>Ted Simons:
If only they were all that easy. House Bill 2615: issuing permits for solar photovoltaic systems. Is there a problem with issuing those permits now?

>>Lucy Mason:
You know, what we wanted to do was "incentivize" for building and for growth. And I understand that we're going to have building and growth anyway. Why not bring in - how can we make it as simple as possible to bring in the energy efficiency building techniques and technologies and processes that we have now for green buildings, for energy-efficient products and that sort of thing? But we were mainly focusing on how do we get - bring - because LEED is an example that we use in the bill as a standard. And, you know, it's fairly well-known across the country. It's written into Federal Law. And it's a way to build efficient, it's a way to reduce electricity usage, and to conserve. It's all about reducing power usage and water. So, by these new techniques that we have, how could we create a more efficient way to get that through the building permitting process? And that was what this bill was about. Simplest possible way.

>>Ted Simons:
Gotcha. And 2416 now extends property tax incentives. Similarly now, this would be for - not necessarily for land, but for buildings or vice versa?

>>Lucy Mason:
for buildings, for the property. This is already in law. And last year, I extended that law to - from 2011 to 2020. But 2020 isn't long enough, so what we did was we - we extended it out to 2040. And this is for financial certainty, you know. The financial institutions need to have that certainty when they're issuing bonds and loans and that sort of thing.

>>Ted Simons:
Taken as a whole, everything we talked about tonight, it sound as though this is a way to tell companies, to tell those around the country, "hey, we're on the ball here". Is that what your doing?

>>Lucy Mason:
Yes. Absolutely, Ted. We have about 5 billion - well, $5.9 billion of projects and corporations that are out there looking at us right now, waiting to go see what happens with this package of bills. They want to move to Arizona, they recognize that we've got the right population base, we have the right education system with our universities and community colleges for work force, for professionals. We have the right - I mean, we have all the Sun. And we have the right mechanisms except for the policies in place. And one of those is the property tax, major issue and stumbling block. If we don't get - I've got a -

>>Ted Simons:
Well, actually I think we pretty much got to get going here. It sounds as if all this address that particular concern, and we may have to ask you back to find out how it turns out.

>>Lucy Mason:
Well, I hope you do. That would be wonderful. Thank you so much.

>>Ted Simons:
And thank you for joining us on "Horizon".

>>Ted Simons:
Now for our regular Monday feature focusing on issues of concern to those watching the State Legislature and upcoming elections. Two political types go one on one. Tonight, Barrett Marson, the State House Republican Spokesman, goes head to head with John Loredo, a political consultant with Tequida and Gutierrez.

>>Barrett Marson:
Good evening, John.

>>John Loredo:
Hello.

>>Barrett Marson:
Happy Cinco de Mayo, and we probably have a little bit of a smaller audience tonight, and those that are out drinking can drink a little bit more, thanks to the veto that Governor Janet Napolitano issued on some stiff DUI penalties that the Legislature passed last week, since the show last aired. The Governor took out her veto stamp on a bill that increased penalties for Extreme DUI, that changed - that fixed sort of a little screw up in state law, and increased boating under the influence. All great changes that were needed, and the Governor didn't see fit to sign that bill. I mean, is she siding with drunk drivers here, John?

>>John Loredo:
Well, I think the reality is that it also reduced the interlock device time from 12 months to six months --

>>Barrett Marson: Sure.

>>John Loredo:
Which I think, you know, I mean, I think the real issue - part of the rub on this bill is -

>>Barrett Marson:
That it was sponsored by House Speaker Jim Weiers. That's what you were about to say, is that right? It's sponsored by Speaker Weiers.

>>John Loredo:
Well, no, the people who took it to Speaker Weiers was the alcohol industry. I mean, these are the folks that are always opposed to increasing fines, because they want to sell their product regardless of the social consequences of drinking and driving.

>>Barrett Marson:
But here's the thing about - here's the thing. Here's where that whole thing just melts - is you've got the whole reason why you could even limit your time on the interlock device, which is something you have to blow into everytime you start your car or when you're driving, is if you changed your behavior - you went to alcohol treatment, stayed off alcohol or, you know, reasonably there, you didn't violate the interlock device limits. If you did that for six months, you then could lower the time that you had the interlock, because you've changed your behavior. You're no longer a threat. And isn't that the point?

>>John Loredo:
Hey, I commend the Republican caucuses for finally coming to the realization and having the epiphany that treatment is a legitimate substitute for hard time behind bars.

>>Barrett Marson:
So leave it to the Democrat Governor to veto it, then?

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is it took a member of the Republican caucus to get busted on a DUI for them to have this epiphany to begin with, and -

>>Barrett Marson:
No, that's not true.

>>John Loredo:
Unfortunately -

>>Barrett Marson:
That's not true.

>>John Loredo: -
That whole concept of treatment vs. time behind bars isn't going to transfer over to any other crime except this.

>>Barrett Marson:
OK.

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is that it reduced the amount of time that a person would have to blow into that interlock device -

>>Barrett Marson:
Only based on treatment -

>>John Loredo: -
to six months.

>>Barrett Marson:
Only based on treatment and staying off alcohol, and it was vetoed. And now - another bill that was vetoed was the Sanctuary City Bill as well, that said police - local police officers were asked to cooperate with ICE agents, federal agents, when it came time to arresting people who maybe had suspicious citizenship status. And that bill was also vetoed. I really don't understand how the Governor can say, "look, we've got to get everybody involved, we've got to clamp down on the border", and veto such a simple bill like this that had no cost to local governments. Because in the bill it specifically said the Federal Government will pay for it, and if they don't, the State will.

>>John Loredo:
But that's a cost. The reality is that estimate for this bill, if the local governments, cities and towns and counties wouldn't paid for it, it's going to cost up to $130 million. There was no appropriation -

>>Barrett Marson:
That is, by the way, a figment of someone's imagination.

>>John Loredo: -
There was no appropriations attached to this bill, and the reality is that when you leave an open-ended funding mandate like that on the general fund, you know, there's a term for that that we like to use. It's called the "Alt-Fuels" kind of fund. When you even open the tabs-

>>Barrett Marson:
So, you're saying law enforcement is "Alt-Fuels"? You know, we have - the Governor sends

>>John Loredo: -
Paying the tabs for this training would have been an open tab.

>>Barrett Marson:
The Governor said - you're saying that training law enforcement is like wasting money in "Alt-Fuels" -

>>John Loredo:
I didn't, I didn't say that.

>>Barrett Marson:
But the problem is - the problem here is you've got the law enforcement, who want to do something, you've got - it costs a lot of money to house illegal immigrants in our prisons, in our State prisons. This would have been a way to cut back those costs, and a simple way to do it. When someone's arrested, you call - you check the -

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is, in any law enforcement agency in the State of Arizona, when somebody is arrested for a crime, their immigration status is checked. That's the way that it goes. So, the reality is that local law enforcement and local communities need to determine how they enforce these immigration laws, and it's best left up to them.

>>Barrett Marson:
Yea, don't worry about the law again.

>>John Loredo:
We also had a bill recently that was one of Russell Pearce's bills to attack Hispanic student organizations in the State. It was very disturbing to me to see the House Appropriations Committee talk about this bill, because there was absolute lie after absolute lie from people at the podium testifying on this bill that had everything from outrageous statements about Hispanic student organizations teach Hispanic students to murder White people.

>>Barrett Marson:
You know -

>>John Loredo: -
Just absolutely ridiculous ,and very offensive, quite frankly, to Hispanic citizens and people all over the place who are very productive, who have been involved in these Hispanic organizations that teach American values and are very, very committed to American values.

>>Barrett Marson:
The bill's really a response to some of the stories that have come out in the "Arizona republic" attacking -

>>John Loredo:
Well, stories, stories.

>>Barrett Marson: -
attacking the Raza Program down in TUSC: Tucson Unified School District. And that's - the bill was meant to target that very secretive program. 'Cause remember, even Tom Horne -

>>John Loredo:
But that's not a secretive program.

>>Barrett Marson: -
Tom Horne tried to get information, and the Superintendent of Public Instruction here in Arizona could not, he was rebuffed. And so, this was an attempt to -

>>John Loredo:
But those meetings are open to anyone who walks in.

>>Barrett Marson:
But those - no, they're not open. No, no, they are not open to anybody who walks in.

>>John Loredo:
They are absolutely open, Barrett.

>>Barrett Marson:
And so, no - well, apparently everyone then, except Tom Horne, our Superintendent of Public Instruction. So this bill -

>>John Loredo:
He's probably afraid to go to a school with a bunch of Hispanic students.

>>Barrett Marson:
Well, I think that's a bad thing to say about Tom Horne. I don't think it's true at all.

>>John Loredo:
He's a wonderful guy, whose lowballing the ELL, by the way.

>>Barrett Marson:
And so -

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is that there are a lot of people, including Legislators - I mean, I was sitting there the day that that happened. I was sitting there watching a news a story about some of the National Guard people coming back from Afghanistan. And I'm looking at that thing, and they wind up interviewing one of the students that was in one of those organizations with me ,who was draped in the American Flag, having just served his country. Very extremely offensive at a time when John McCain is trying to reach out to Hispanics.

>>Barrett Marson:
Yea. I'm not sure. Maybe - I'm not sure if the bill is the correct answer. But that's what it was trying to address. Now, what the Legislature is trying to address, though, is the 2009 State Budget. It went from 1.6 to $2 billion in the hole. And you're seeing those kind of talks continue right now. I know that you perceive it as a stalemate, and you raise that as an issue. I just don't understand because the Governor made a proposal. The Governor issued a proposal. Now, it's up to the Republicans to counter-offer, and that's exactly what we're now going through, is a counter-offer. If it's taking too long for you, I'm sorry, but this is not a stalemate. This is not coming up with - what is the Republican response? It's not -

>>John Loredo:
Part of the issue here is that I remember sitting here at the beginning of the Legislative Session, when we talked about, you know, we're going to take the first two weeks of session, and we're gonna to fix the '08 budget, and we're gonna move right into the '09. Here we are five months later, four months later, and we're barely ending the '08.

>>Barrett Marson:
And if the Governor had just agreed - and if the Governor had just agreed with what the Republicans had put on the table long before, we would have done it. Because that's exactly what happened. So - but I'm sure we'll see each other in a couple of weeks, and we can talk about the same thing again, John.

>>Ted Simons:
Recently, ASU's Center for Film, Media and Popular Culture honored Roy Orbison with a posthumous Lifetime Achievement Award. It was given to his widow, Barbara Orbison, who was also his manager. She received an award from ASU as well, honoring her work maintaining the Orbison musical legacy since his death in 1988. She was also the producer of one of the most successful programs ever on PBS, "Roy Orbison and Friends, A Black and White Night." Larry Lemmons spoke with Orbison before the ceremony.

[music]

>>Roy Orbison
(Singing): Sweet dreams baby. Sweet dreams baby. Sweet dreams baby. How long must I dream?

>>Larry Lemmons:
This particular show: The Black and White Concert by Roy Orbison might be the highest-pledged program on PBS.

>>Barbara Orbison:
It's the highest pledge, and I guess the longest pledge. It's been an incredible marriage between PBS and the show called "Black and White Night of Roy Orbison and Friends" because without the friends -

>>Larry Lemmons:
You say without the friends. But I have to say, you know, he wouldn't have had those friends were it not for his talent. And that's what really makes it incredible, I think, for pbs audiences, is seeing how well-respected he was among his colleagues at the time.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Yea.

>>Larry Lemmons:
Do you remember when that happened?

>>Barbara Orbison:
Yes. I actually helped produce it, and it sort of was my idea as a gift to Roy, a timeless gift to Roy. I wanted it to be black and white, and I wanted everybody to be dressed in a certain way. And the audience, too, so that viewers in 100 years couldn't say, "oh, that was done because of this technical support, like color". So even "The Boss": Bruce Springsteen, I don't think he ever worn a suit onstage, you know. And he said, "no problem". He put on that suit.

>>Larry Lemmons:
You didn't have any difficulty, I would imagine, getting any of those people to do this.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, everybody was really kind and supportive. But some of the players had to change because their dates moved. Like when you have a show like that. But overall, it was like one telephone call and a commitment.

>>Larry Lemmons:
I think it was the first time, too, in a really widespread forum, that people got to see Roy Orbison's talent. I mean, you got to see a lot of the things that he had done. I think a lot of people didn't realize he had been so influential over all those years.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, you know, your question saying that lots of people don't really know that Roy maybe wrote all those songs, or had all those hits, is because in those days, you know, you didn't have television to support you. So you would hear a radio, that lonesome voice somewhere that would sing "Crying" or "Only The Lonely" or "Blue Angel" or "Pretty Woman." But lots of people didn't even have the face to it. And then Roy had an universal career, meaning that he would tour here with Patsy Cline or the Beach Boys, and he would get on the plane, and tour in Australia with the Rolling Stones. And England, you know, the first tour with The Beatles, that's all so much history now. So Roy just never stayed long enough, I think, to really get like a continuous branding, as they call it today, with the voice and the voice. But then, of course, once you have see him with the glasses and that voice, I don't think you ever would forget him, you know?

>>Larry Lemmons:
He really had something of a resurgence. Well, I have to admit that, you know, I - of course I had heard these songs in the past, but - you may not like this, but when I saw "Blue Velvet", David Lynch's film and I saw Dean Stockwell singing "Candy Colored Clown", it was just so sinister, but I saw that song in such a different way - it didn't ruin the song for me, I love that song, but it made it more haunting. And put within that context, for some reason, I think for some reason, so many people heard that voice, that ethereal voice, and forgot just how haunting it was and just how wonderful it was. Can you talk about how that resurgence kind of happened in the 80's also? And then suddenly, he was much more visible than he had been in the past.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, I think there was lots of - Roy really designed his life very much like he designed the glasses, and the way he looked. And I think there's something not to be confused, and that is the personal life of the artist, and the career. And Roy separated those two so well. There was never a Roy Orbison record in our house. I never really listened to the recording 'till after Roy died. I knew the live versions of the songs. There never was like a billboard. There was nothing in our house that really - unless you would go into the studio part, where you would see the guitars and tapes and everything like that. But the other side of Roy's life was completely - he was a totally normal person, but couldn't live without music. And in the 80s, in the middle 80s, actually, around '84-'85, he decided to go one more time for it, and he did. And it was effortless, you know? Of course, you know, like David putting the song "Blue Velvet", and "Dreams in Blue Velvet", and I will forever thank David, wherever he might be. And then he had the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame induction. He did the Black and White Night, he finished an album called "Mystery Girl."

>>Larry Lemmons:
And The Traveling Wilburys.

>>Barbara Orbison:
And then The Traveling Wilburys. And so, and that all was very effortless. One thing came after the other. It was just like - and it wasn't necessarily designed. It wasn't like he said "I'm armed with a management team", and say this is what I want to do. But he had one wish, and that was, he said, "I want to be in the charts again." He said, "I love being applauded by everybody, but I want to be in the charts." And that's what he was. You know, Bono came forward to do "Mystery Girl", "A Love So Beautiful", or "Blues" for The Black and White Night." And by the time "Mystery Girl" came out, and The Traveling Willberries, he was right in the charts with everybody. So that's to personal life. And then you have a career.

>>Larry Lemmons:
What kind of person was he? Who was Roy Orbison to you? Your husband.

>>Barbara Orbison:
He was - he was just a hell of a nice guy. He was born that way. I always say he was calm and sweet. He just came one way, and that was he was a kind, kind heart. He was really, really smart. Really bright. Loved to laugh. I mean, probably 85\% of a day with him was spent in laughter about something. He was very fast-footed, you know.

>>Larry Lemmons:
Barbara Orbison, thanks so much for talking to Horizon.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Thank you.

>>Roy Orbison
(Singing): Sweet dreams baby, you can make my dreams come true.

>>Ted Simons:
Tomorrow on "Horizon", Arizona Attorney General Terry Goddard joins us to discuss investigations and prosecutions of polygamy-related crimes in our State, and talk about his plans to co-host a Town Hall on media and polygamy.

>>Ted Simons:
That's it for now. Thank you so much for joining us. I'm Ted Simons. You have a great evening.

>>Announcer:
If you have comments about "Horizon", please contact us at the addresses listed on the screen. Your name and comments may be used on a future edition of "Horizon".

>>Announcer:
"Horizon" is made possible by contributions from the Friends of Eight, members of your Arizona PBS station. Thank you.

Sustainability Legislation

  |   Video
  • An examination of proposed state legislation for the environment with sponsor Representative Lucy Mason (R-Prescott).
Guests:
  • Lucy Mason - State Representative
  • Barrett Marson - Spokeman, State House Republicans
  • John Loredo - Political consultant, Tequida and Gutierrez
Category: Sustainability

View Transcript
>>Ted Simons:
Tonight on "Horizon": State legislation is being considered that could make an environmental impact. Issues at the State Legislature and upcoming elections are confronted by our political antagonists in "One-On-One". And a conversation with the widow of Roy Orbison about one of PBS's most popular shows. That's next, on "Horizon".

>>Announcer:
"Horizon" is made possible by contributions from the Friends of Eight, members of your Arizona PBS station. Thank you.

>>Ted Simons:
Good evening, and welcome to "Horizon". I'm Ted Simons. The Arizona Republic reported recently that environmental bills are given a low priority in the State Legislature. Despite the less than perfect focus on environmental issues locally, the term "sustainability" seems to have taken the national media by storm. The primary difference between the old "environmental" label and the new one, "sustainability", is that the latter takes into account the input of business and economic concerns necessary to make real changes in the way we live. With that in mind, we take a look at three bills sponsored by Representative Lucy Mason of Prescott. Thank you so much for joining us here on "Horizon".

>>Lucy Mason:
Thank you so much, Ted.

>>Ted Simons:
Before we look at these bills' specifics here, and get into them, why you and why this issue?

>>Lucy Mason:
You know, I've been very interested in how we grow here in Arizona. I've been a legislator for six years now. And I got very interested in the electricity needs that we're trying to serve this growth. And how do we do that? You know, where do we purchase our power from? And when we have certain things like a fact of 250,000 people move into the State roughly a year - in the past, that's what we've experienced. Right now, we have 193,000 people who have moved into this State. Even with the downturn, we're still growing. Where does the electricity come from? And how do we provide that? I've been very interested in how we have such wonderful new technologies now, and how can we use those in Arizona? And how can we use what we have, which is the Sun? So I got very excited and talked with the utilities. They were kind of asking very similar questions. With our growth, where are we going to purchase our power from next? For example, we're spending billions of dollars - and $1 billion a year, I hear, from APS - from purchasing power from out of state. Why not build our power, generate our power and manufacture those implements we need to build those generation stations here in Arizona? So it's all in the how.

>>Ted Simons:
Yeah. There are a lot of "hows" here. There's a lot of stuff going on here, including something called performance contracting. Without getting too deeply into this, in general, what are we talk about here?

>>Lucy Mason:
What this allows is schools and public buildings to be able to purchase energy-efficient products, systems, and then enter into this contract and allow them to pay back the costs of the product through their savings. Because we found that there's tremendous savings by getting into energy efficiencies. Whether it's buildings, whether it's building green, whether it's using energy-efficient "Energy Star", if you will, products and systems, it's a tremendous savings overall in utility bills.

>>Ted Simons:
Is there enough savings there to go ahead and pay for something like this?

>>Lucy Mason:
Oh, there is. And it depends on the size of the system, it depends on the longevity of the contract. But by and large, you can end up saving a tremendous amount of money on utility bills. Of course I'm very interested in that, because of the revenues that - we're dealing with a revenue shortage, we're dealing with with the State Budget deficit right now.

>>Ted Simons:
Another aspect of this one particular bill, 2766, is the vehicle idling requirements. I think we all have walked past idling buses and trucks and gone, "gee, that doesn't seem like the right thing to do". If you want to change it, how do you enforce something like that?

>>Lucy Mason:
Well, what we're trying to do is recognize that we have commercial trucks that have to keep going. I mean, we're dealing with extreme temperatures which we do here in Arizona all the time, whether in Flagstaff being cold, or down here in Maricopa County, when we're at the peak of our heat in the summer. We've got to allow these cabs of these trucks to be able to idle and to be able to keep cool or keep warm, depending on where we are in the State, for commercial use. And so - there's a list, they get a pass because they've got to be able to stay in business. But what we didn't want to do was for tourism. If there were, you know, people traveling through the State and they get into Flagstaff and they're parked overnight, you know, and it's very cold, you know, they need to be able to idle to heat their vehicles. And so, we want to make sure - But the main thing, though, is that the "5-Minute Rule", which is in the bill, we're looking at schools and school districts, and how the school buses are idling. There's a very simple thing that they can do, and it doesn't take an enforcement code or a mandate from the State. The school district can take care of this and just simply turn it off, turn off the engine if they're idling, if they're going to be idling longer than five minutes.

>>Ted Simons:
OK. Other aspects of this bill. Energy-efficiency standards for all sorts of things up to and including pool pumps.

>>Lucy Mason:
We go real big, and then we go down to this. Well, we found that the pool pumps really do use a tremendous amount of electricity. And by and large as an appliance, if you will, we needed to look at how we can use something that is more efficient. And so, we used the standards that are out there, and probably will be implemented by the Federal Government at some point. So we'll just be a little bit ahead of the game.

>>Ted Simons:
There are a lot of thing in this bill. I know one of the criticisms coming from fellow lawmakers was that there's too much in the bill. It's too broad. Your response.

>>Lucy Mason:
My response to that has been, "let me sit down and visit with you. I can help you understand this bill." When you read through legal language, you can have the simplest intent and the simplest reason for having that bill, but legal language will make it sound very, very complicated. And so, when people come to me and they say this, I just say, "let me help you understand this bill". And I've done that. I've taken staff with me, and we've gone in ,and gone one by one, over each one of the provisions in the bill. And it becomes pretty simple pretty quick. For example, one of my colleagues once I did that with him, and he said, "oh, well, I can support this."

>>Ted Simons:
Interesting. OK.

>>Lucy Mason:
And that was one of my biggest opponents actually to the bill.

>>Ted Simons:
If only they were all that easy. House Bill 2615: issuing permits for solar photovoltaic systems. Is there a problem with issuing those permits now?

>>Lucy Mason:
You know, what we wanted to do was "incentivize" for building and for growth. And I understand that we're going to have building and growth anyway. Why not bring in - how can we make it as simple as possible to bring in the energy efficiency building techniques and technologies and processes that we have now for green buildings, for energy-efficient products and that sort of thing? But we were mainly focusing on how do we get - bring - because LEED is an example that we use in the bill as a standard. And, you know, it's fairly well-known across the country. It's written into Federal Law. And it's a way to build efficient, it's a way to reduce electricity usage, and to conserve. It's all about reducing power usage and water. So, by these new techniques that we have, how could we create a more efficient way to get that through the building permitting process? And that was what this bill was about. Simplest possible way.

>>Ted Simons:
Gotcha. And 2416 now extends property tax incentives. Similarly now, this would be for - not necessarily for land, but for buildings or vice versa?

>>Lucy Mason:
for buildings, for the property. This is already in law. And last year, I extended that law to - from 2011 to 2020. But 2020 isn't long enough, so what we did was we - we extended it out to 2040. And this is for financial certainty, you know. The financial institutions need to have that certainty when they're issuing bonds and loans and that sort of thing.

>>Ted Simons:
Taken as a whole, everything we talked about tonight, it sound as though this is a way to tell companies, to tell those around the country, "hey, we're on the ball here". Is that what your doing?

>>Lucy Mason:
Yes. Absolutely, Ted. We have about 5 billion - well, $5.9 billion of projects and corporations that are out there looking at us right now, waiting to go see what happens with this package of bills. They want to move to Arizona, they recognize that we've got the right population base, we have the right education system with our universities and community colleges for work force, for professionals. We have the right - I mean, we have all the Sun. And we have the right mechanisms except for the policies in place. And one of those is the property tax, major issue and stumbling block. If we don't get - I've got a -

>>Ted Simons:
Well, actually I think we pretty much got to get going here. It sounds as if all this address that particular concern, and we may have to ask you back to find out how it turns out.

>>Lucy Mason:
Well, I hope you do. That would be wonderful. Thank you so much.

>>Ted Simons:
And thank you for joining us on "Horizon".

>>Ted Simons:
Now for our regular Monday feature focusing on issues of concern to those watching the State Legislature and upcoming elections. Two political types go one on one. Tonight, Barrett Marson, the State House Republican Spokesman, goes head to head with John Loredo, a political consultant with Tequida and Gutierrez.

>>Barrett Marson:
Good evening, John.

>>John Loredo:
Hello.

>>Barrett Marson:
Happy Cinco de Mayo, and we probably have a little bit of a smaller audience tonight, and those that are out drinking can drink a little bit more, thanks to the veto that Governor Janet Napolitano issued on some stiff DUI penalties that the Legislature passed last week, since the show last aired. The Governor took out her veto stamp on a bill that increased penalties for Extreme DUI, that changed - that fixed sort of a little screw up in state law, and increased boating under the influence. All great changes that were needed, and the Governor didn't see fit to sign that bill. I mean, is she siding with drunk drivers here, John?

>>John Loredo:
Well, I think the reality is that it also reduced the interlock device time from 12 months to six months --

>>Barrett Marson: Sure.

>>John Loredo:
Which I think, you know, I mean, I think the real issue - part of the rub on this bill is -

>>Barrett Marson:
That it was sponsored by House Speaker Jim Weiers. That's what you were about to say, is that right? It's sponsored by Speaker Weiers.

>>John Loredo:
Well, no, the people who took it to Speaker Weiers was the alcohol industry. I mean, these are the folks that are always opposed to increasing fines, because they want to sell their product regardless of the social consequences of drinking and driving.

>>Barrett Marson:
But here's the thing about - here's the thing. Here's where that whole thing just melts - is you've got the whole reason why you could even limit your time on the interlock device, which is something you have to blow into everytime you start your car or when you're driving, is if you changed your behavior - you went to alcohol treatment, stayed off alcohol or, you know, reasonably there, you didn't violate the interlock device limits. If you did that for six months, you then could lower the time that you had the interlock, because you've changed your behavior. You're no longer a threat. And isn't that the point?

>>John Loredo:
Hey, I commend the Republican caucuses for finally coming to the realization and having the epiphany that treatment is a legitimate substitute for hard time behind bars.

>>Barrett Marson:
So leave it to the Democrat Governor to veto it, then?

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is it took a member of the Republican caucus to get busted on a DUI for them to have this epiphany to begin with, and -

>>Barrett Marson:
No, that's not true.

>>John Loredo:
Unfortunately -

>>Barrett Marson:
That's not true.

>>John Loredo: -
That whole concept of treatment vs. time behind bars isn't going to transfer over to any other crime except this.

>>Barrett Marson:
OK.

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is that it reduced the amount of time that a person would have to blow into that interlock device -

>>Barrett Marson:
Only based on treatment -

>>John Loredo: -
to six months.

>>Barrett Marson:
Only based on treatment and staying off alcohol, and it was vetoed. And now - another bill that was vetoed was the Sanctuary City Bill as well, that said police - local police officers were asked to cooperate with ICE agents, federal agents, when it came time to arresting people who maybe had suspicious citizenship status. And that bill was also vetoed. I really don't understand how the Governor can say, "look, we've got to get everybody involved, we've got to clamp down on the border", and veto such a simple bill like this that had no cost to local governments. Because in the bill it specifically said the Federal Government will pay for it, and if they don't, the State will.

>>John Loredo:
But that's a cost. The reality is that estimate for this bill, if the local governments, cities and towns and counties wouldn't paid for it, it's going to cost up to $130 million. There was no appropriation -

>>Barrett Marson:
That is, by the way, a figment of someone's imagination.

>>John Loredo: -
There was no appropriations attached to this bill, and the reality is that when you leave an open-ended funding mandate like that on the general fund, you know, there's a term for that that we like to use. It's called the "Alt-Fuels" kind of fund. When you even open the tabs-

>>Barrett Marson:
So, you're saying law enforcement is "Alt-Fuels"? You know, we have - the Governor sends

>>John Loredo: -
Paying the tabs for this training would have been an open tab.

>>Barrett Marson:
The Governor said - you're saying that training law enforcement is like wasting money in "Alt-Fuels" -

>>John Loredo:
I didn't, I didn't say that.

>>Barrett Marson:
But the problem is - the problem here is you've got the law enforcement, who want to do something, you've got - it costs a lot of money to house illegal immigrants in our prisons, in our State prisons. This would have been a way to cut back those costs, and a simple way to do it. When someone's arrested, you call - you check the -

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is, in any law enforcement agency in the State of Arizona, when somebody is arrested for a crime, their immigration status is checked. That's the way that it goes. So, the reality is that local law enforcement and local communities need to determine how they enforce these immigration laws, and it's best left up to them.

>>Barrett Marson:
Yea, don't worry about the law again.

>>John Loredo:
We also had a bill recently that was one of Russell Pearce's bills to attack Hispanic student organizations in the State. It was very disturbing to me to see the House Appropriations Committee talk about this bill, because there was absolute lie after absolute lie from people at the podium testifying on this bill that had everything from outrageous statements about Hispanic student organizations teach Hispanic students to murder White people.

>>Barrett Marson:
You know -

>>John Loredo: -
Just absolutely ridiculous ,and very offensive, quite frankly, to Hispanic citizens and people all over the place who are very productive, who have been involved in these Hispanic organizations that teach American values and are very, very committed to American values.

>>Barrett Marson:
The bill's really a response to some of the stories that have come out in the "Arizona republic" attacking -

>>John Loredo:
Well, stories, stories.

>>Barrett Marson: -
attacking the Raza Program down in TUSC: Tucson Unified School District. And that's - the bill was meant to target that very secretive program. 'Cause remember, even Tom Horne -

>>John Loredo:
But that's not a secretive program.

>>Barrett Marson: -
Tom Horne tried to get information, and the Superintendent of Public Instruction here in Arizona could not, he was rebuffed. And so, this was an attempt to -

>>John Loredo:
But those meetings are open to anyone who walks in.

>>Barrett Marson:
But those - no, they're not open. No, no, they are not open to anybody who walks in.

>>John Loredo:
They are absolutely open, Barrett.

>>Barrett Marson:
And so, no - well, apparently everyone then, except Tom Horne, our Superintendent of Public Instruction. So this bill -

>>John Loredo:
He's probably afraid to go to a school with a bunch of Hispanic students.

>>Barrett Marson:
Well, I think that's a bad thing to say about Tom Horne. I don't think it's true at all.

>>John Loredo:
He's a wonderful guy, whose lowballing the ELL, by the way.

>>Barrett Marson:
And so -

>>John Loredo:
But the reality is that there are a lot of people, including Legislators - I mean, I was sitting there the day that that happened. I was sitting there watching a news a story about some of the National Guard people coming back from Afghanistan. And I'm looking at that thing, and they wind up interviewing one of the students that was in one of those organizations with me ,who was draped in the American Flag, having just served his country. Very extremely offensive at a time when John McCain is trying to reach out to Hispanics.

>>Barrett Marson:
Yea. I'm not sure. Maybe - I'm not sure if the bill is the correct answer. But that's what it was trying to address. Now, what the Legislature is trying to address, though, is the 2009 State Budget. It went from 1.6 to $2 billion in the hole. And you're seeing those kind of talks continue right now. I know that you perceive it as a stalemate, and you raise that as an issue. I just don't understand because the Governor made a proposal. The Governor issued a proposal. Now, it's up to the Republicans to counter-offer, and that's exactly what we're now going through, is a counter-offer. If it's taking too long for you, I'm sorry, but this is not a stalemate. This is not coming up with - what is the Republican response? It's not -

>>John Loredo:
Part of the issue here is that I remember sitting here at the beginning of the Legislative Session, when we talked about, you know, we're going to take the first two weeks of session, and we're gonna to fix the '08 budget, and we're gonna move right into the '09. Here we are five months later, four months later, and we're barely ending the '08.

>>Barrett Marson:
And if the Governor had just agreed - and if the Governor had just agreed with what the Republicans had put on the table long before, we would have done it. Because that's exactly what happened. So - but I'm sure we'll see each other in a couple of weeks, and we can talk about the same thing again, John.

>>Ted Simons:
Recently, ASU's Center for Film, Media and Popular Culture honored Roy Orbison with a posthumous Lifetime Achievement Award. It was given to his widow, Barbara Orbison, who was also his manager. She received an award from ASU as well, honoring her work maintaining the Orbison musical legacy since his death in 1988. She was also the producer of one of the most successful programs ever on PBS, "Roy Orbison and Friends, A Black and White Night." Larry Lemmons spoke with Orbison before the ceremony.

[music]

>>Roy Orbison
(Singing): Sweet dreams baby. Sweet dreams baby. Sweet dreams baby. How long must I dream?

>>Larry Lemmons:
This particular show: The Black and White Concert by Roy Orbison might be the highest-pledged program on PBS.

>>Barbara Orbison:
It's the highest pledge, and I guess the longest pledge. It's been an incredible marriage between PBS and the show called "Black and White Night of Roy Orbison and Friends" because without the friends -

>>Larry Lemmons:
You say without the friends. But I have to say, you know, he wouldn't have had those friends were it not for his talent. And that's what really makes it incredible, I think, for pbs audiences, is seeing how well-respected he was among his colleagues at the time.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Yea.

>>Larry Lemmons:
Do you remember when that happened?

>>Barbara Orbison:
Yes. I actually helped produce it, and it sort of was my idea as a gift to Roy, a timeless gift to Roy. I wanted it to be black and white, and I wanted everybody to be dressed in a certain way. And the audience, too, so that viewers in 100 years couldn't say, "oh, that was done because of this technical support, like color". So even "The Boss": Bruce Springsteen, I don't think he ever worn a suit onstage, you know. And he said, "no problem". He put on that suit.

>>Larry Lemmons:
You didn't have any difficulty, I would imagine, getting any of those people to do this.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, everybody was really kind and supportive. But some of the players had to change because their dates moved. Like when you have a show like that. But overall, it was like one telephone call and a commitment.

>>Larry Lemmons:
I think it was the first time, too, in a really widespread forum, that people got to see Roy Orbison's talent. I mean, you got to see a lot of the things that he had done. I think a lot of people didn't realize he had been so influential over all those years.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, you know, your question saying that lots of people don't really know that Roy maybe wrote all those songs, or had all those hits, is because in those days, you know, you didn't have television to support you. So you would hear a radio, that lonesome voice somewhere that would sing "Crying" or "Only The Lonely" or "Blue Angel" or "Pretty Woman." But lots of people didn't even have the face to it. And then Roy had an universal career, meaning that he would tour here with Patsy Cline or the Beach Boys, and he would get on the plane, and tour in Australia with the Rolling Stones. And England, you know, the first tour with The Beatles, that's all so much history now. So Roy just never stayed long enough, I think, to really get like a continuous branding, as they call it today, with the voice and the voice. But then, of course, once you have see him with the glasses and that voice, I don't think you ever would forget him, you know?

>>Larry Lemmons:
He really had something of a resurgence. Well, I have to admit that, you know, I - of course I had heard these songs in the past, but - you may not like this, but when I saw "Blue Velvet", David Lynch's film and I saw Dean Stockwell singing "Candy Colored Clown", it was just so sinister, but I saw that song in such a different way - it didn't ruin the song for me, I love that song, but it made it more haunting. And put within that context, for some reason, I think for some reason, so many people heard that voice, that ethereal voice, and forgot just how haunting it was and just how wonderful it was. Can you talk about how that resurgence kind of happened in the 80's also? And then suddenly, he was much more visible than he had been in the past.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Well, I think there was lots of - Roy really designed his life very much like he designed the glasses, and the way he looked. And I think there's something not to be confused, and that is the personal life of the artist, and the career. And Roy separated those two so well. There was never a Roy Orbison record in our house. I never really listened to the recording 'till after Roy died. I knew the live versions of the songs. There never was like a billboard. There was nothing in our house that really - unless you would go into the studio part, where you would see the guitars and tapes and everything like that. But the other side of Roy's life was completely - he was a totally normal person, but couldn't live without music. And in the 80s, in the middle 80s, actually, around '84-'85, he decided to go one more time for it, and he did. And it was effortless, you know? Of course, you know, like David putting the song "Blue Velvet", and "Dreams in Blue Velvet", and I will forever thank David, wherever he might be. And then he had the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame induction. He did the Black and White Night, he finished an album called "Mystery Girl."

>>Larry Lemmons:
And The Traveling Wilburys.

>>Barbara Orbison:
And then The Traveling Wilburys. And so, and that all was very effortless. One thing came after the other. It was just like - and it wasn't necessarily designed. It wasn't like he said "I'm armed with a management team", and say this is what I want to do. But he had one wish, and that was, he said, "I want to be in the charts again." He said, "I love being applauded by everybody, but I want to be in the charts." And that's what he was. You know, Bono came forward to do "Mystery Girl", "A Love So Beautiful", or "Blues" for The Black and White Night." And by the time "Mystery Girl" came out, and The Traveling Willberries, he was right in the charts with everybody. So that's to personal life. And then you have a career.

>>Larry Lemmons:
What kind of person was he? Who was Roy Orbison to you? Your husband.

>>Barbara Orbison:
He was - he was just a hell of a nice guy. He was born that way. I always say he was calm and sweet. He just came one way, and that was he was a kind, kind heart. He was really, really smart. Really bright. Loved to laugh. I mean, probably 85\% of a day with him was spent in laughter about something. He was very fast-footed, you know.

>>Larry Lemmons:
Barbara Orbison, thanks so much for talking to Horizon.

>>Barbara Orbison:
Thank you.

>>Roy Orbison
(Singing): Sweet dreams baby, you can make my dreams come true.

>>Ted Simons:
Tomorrow on "Horizon", Arizona Attorney General Terry Goddard joins us to discuss investigations and prosecutions of polygamy-related crimes in our State, and talk about his plans to co-host a Town Hall on media and polygamy.

>>Ted Simons:
That's it for now. Thank you so much for joining us. I'm Ted Simons. You have a great evening.

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