Horizon, Host: Ted Simons

February 3, 2005


Host: Michael Grant

Arizona Theatre Company


Guests:
  • Janet Napolitano - Arizona Governor


View Transcript
> Michael Grant:
Tonight on "Horizon," President Bush gave his state of the union speech last night. We'll get reaction from some members of our congressional delegation around our Governor. Plus, the legislature is ramping up its effort at passing new laws. We'll talk to the Governor about the latest bills including one that would deal with Arizona's nursing shortage. That's coming up next on "Horizon."

Announcer: "Horizon" is made possible by the friends of channel 8, members who provide financial support to this Arizona PBS station. Thank you.

>> Michael Grant: Good evening, I'm Michael Grant. In his state of the union speech last night, President Bush made his pitch for reforming Social Security. He also outlined other issues, including one of great interest to Arizonans, immigration reform. We'll talk to Governor Janet Napolitano on "First Thursday, the Governor on Horizon," about the president's address and also about state issues, but first, here is reaction from two of our state's congressional delegation on the president's speech.

>>Sen. Jon Kyl:
What you see it what you get. What he campaigned on are the same themes you saw in the speech. The concept of liberty abroad, the fact that prepare is on the march and that he wanted to do what he could do to promote that, and then here at home, the themes that he campaigned on to ensure that our younger generation would have Social Security to count on when they get ready to retire. Obviously, the front and centerpiece of the talk tonight. But also other issues like the tax reform, making his tax cuts permanent, immigration reform, important to Arizona, and the other issues that he campaigned on, making sure we can get the judges that he nominates confirmed. All of these are important items. I'm glad he brought them up. Well tonight he certainly got more detailed about his proposal, including the personal accounts. I think most people, particularly younger people in this country, understand the benefits of being able to invest some of this money in your own personal account, to be able to control that money, to have it grow as the value grows with any other investments, and to be able to count therefore on more money available at the time of your retirement than what Social Security is likely to provide. At least younger people can appreciate that. As the president noted, those nearing retirement are not going to be able to take advantage of that, but their Social Security isn't going to be changed in any way. Their benefits are guaranteed. I should say our benefits now. But younger people would have a lot more opportunity in this country to own their own personal account if the president's plan can be adopted.

>>Rep. Ed Pastor:
The president tonight gave us a rosy picture, but the reality is, we're at war. 1400 men and women have given their lives. 10,000 people are in the hospital with their wounds. He talks about giving programs to Americans, but what he doesn't say is that he will not do anything about reducing the tax break and again talks about cutting programs. 150 programs he's going cut. How is he going to give a PELL grant increase when there is no money? He talks about Social Security and what a crisis it is. The reality is, there is no crisis. The crisis in America today is the lack of health insurance for 43 million people. He should have spoken on that today and what is he going to do to give affordable health insurance not only to our children but to our grandchildren. The state of the state is not that rosy.

>> Michael Grant:
Here now is Governor Janet Napolitano.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Next week I'm doing a guest coach stint there partnership did the U of A women's team. We lost in overtime, but it was a lot of fun.

>> Michael Grant:
You are 4 and 2 because you are temporary coach for the mercury a couple of times.

>> Janet Napolitano:
The mercury, sun devils and wildcats. It's fun to sit on the bench and act like I know something.

>> Michael Grant:
Are you plugging for like a third career.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Who knows when you are going to need another day job.

>> Michael Grant:
I think the lakers may have an opening for you.

>> Janet Napolitano:
I hear they may have a vacancy. I'm sure they'll call.

>> Michael Grant:
You are two out of three. I want to talk about a couple of the state of the union subjects. Let me get your overall reaction to the speech where you obviously just heard from Senator Kyl and congressman pastor.

>> Janet Napolitano:
On a technical matter, I thought it was very well done. I thought it was well-written, very well constructed speech. I thought the president delivered it well. He's clearly gotten better at this sort of thing as time has gone on. And the moment at the end of the speech when the mother of the marine who died in the battle of Fallujah and the daughter of the man who had been killed by Saddam, hugged, you know, there are moments that transcend politics and that trans-sends speech-making quite frankly and that was one of those moments.

>> Michael Grant:
The president obviously focused mostly on Social Security. He did touch on immigration reform, again, not giving very many specifics, but I think saying something like, we need to reform immigration to allow business to hire workers for jobs that Americans do not want. I know we've talked about this subject before. You generally favor a guest worker-type program, do you not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Yes, I do. I think it's a necessary change in our immigration laws, and I actually think Arizona is really bearing the burden of a federal immigration law now that simply doesn't work. You know, it has fostered chaos along the border, and we're a border state, and we experience that more so than other states. I was glad to seat president include at least a mention of it in his state of the union.

>> Michael Grant:
Let me avoid the term "amnesty" because I think it carries a lot of baggage with it.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Right.

>> Michael Grant:
Let me describe it more in these terms. Some people say, well, listen, if you are here illegally, a program should give you the opportunity to go ahead and work toward legalizing your status. Some might call that amnesty, others would term it other things. Should that be a component of this package or not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Well, I think you can't do a guest worker program without considering those who are already here and those who are yet to come. When you think of those who are already in the country illegally, you have different categories. You have people who have been living in this country illegally for 20, 30, 40 years, paying taxes, never broken any law, been working the whole time. You have children who have been either brought here as babies or as young children who have grown up here. Shouldn't they have a chance? They didn't come over here over their own volition. Shouldn't they have a chance for citizenship? And then you have those who have just recently immigrated in the last year or two. It seems to me as the Congress takes this up, they ought to consider different people in different categories separately. They are not all the same.

>> Michael Grant:
What about the argument, though, that, yeah, but if you allow people to do that, you really invite the next set of people to violate whatever new policy you have.

>> Janet Napolitano:
That's why you can't do a blanket amnesty. That's why you can't do something that is a cookie-cutter approach to the whole group. But I think you can divide into certain subgroups and make logical decisions. The plain fact of the matter is that people from Mexico have been coming to this country, not because they can become citizens, but because they can get jobs, and they don't have a similar job market in Mexico.

>> Michael Grant:
Right.

>> Janet Napolitano:

It's primarily an economic immigration.

>> Michael Grant:
Final question on this subject. Congressman Flake indicated that he may be a couple, three weeks away from dropping the legislation in congress that he has been working on, apparently with congressman Kolbe and also Senator MCCain. Have you gotten any kind of preview on what that's going to look like?

>> Janet Napolitano:
No, I haven't. I know the three of them had been working, and others on the hill have been working, and really, if we're going to get any federal immigration reform, it has to be led by the president and it really needs to be led this year an off-election year. I'm very much in favor of our delegation moving forward on this. , as I've said many times, one of the things I think Prop 200 represented was the frustration of Arizonans that nobody was really taking up the problem of the border and the federal immigration and that needs to be done and it should be done now.

>> Michael Grant:
Privatize at least part of Social Security?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Well, you know, if I had to pick a domestic crisis, I'd have to say I wouldn't have picked Social Security. Sure there are changes that is can and should be made, but people have been predicting the demise of Social Security since it was originally enacted. And you know, I would have to say we're -- where I'm sitting dealing with AHCCCS, where we've got a million people in Arizona on Medicaid dealing with another million Arizonans who have no health insurance, healthcare to me is really in a crisis and it's a train wreck getting ready to happen. I didn't hear enough from the president on that. And we're going to have to wait for his budget to see -- you know, this transition on Social Security, one thing he didn't talk about was the billions of dollars that will cost in transition costs, and how that's going to be paid for. Well, you either have to increase our already too-large deficit or you have to cut domestic spending somewhere else. Where is it going to come from? Medicare? Medicaid? Until those choices become transparent, I don't think we can fairly judge the president's proposal.

>> Michael Grant:
With boomers retiring, though, the numbers do start getting kind of difficult around 2020. I'm not predicting the imminent collapse of Social Security --

>> Janet Napolitano:
I wouldn't even agree with you there. I've seen numbers that say that up to the year 2042, the system can continue to pay out at the same level.

>> Michael Grant:
Assuming the taxpayer can pay back the IOUs sitting in the account.

>> Janet Napolitano:
But really, you're talking, you know, like -- I think the central point is what is our key domestic -- what is the domestic crisis that is affecting everybody the most right now, that we really need to take up? Now, did you hear anything at all about Social Security during the presidential campaign? No. It wasn't talked about. What was talked about? What was talked about is what is really on people's minds, Iraq and healthcare.

>> Michael Grant:
Uh-huh.

>> Janet Napolitano:
We've got a lot of Iraq in the speech last night, and I thought we should have and it was appropriately addressed. We didn't hear enough about healthcare.

>> Michael Grant:
On the other hand, pretty much a bi-partisan effort in the mid-198os looked at Social Security and said listen, we need to do something to it to put it back on an even keel and people made tough decisions back then.

>> Janet Napolitano:
I'm not saying you shouldn't look at Social Security, what I'm suggesting is to make it the top and basically the only new domestic issue, the fight in congress, I think it's the wrong fight. I think the fight is about healthcare.

>> Michael Grant:
All right. What about the settlement that DPS entered into on the allegations of racial profiling?

>> Janet Napolitano:
This was a case that arose several years ago involving stops along I-40 outside of Flagstaff. The Department of Public Safety without saying whether there was or wasn't racial profiling, we said look what's put into play better procedures and things so that we don't get into the trap of having racial profiling. So the settlement involves better record-keeping. It involves cameras in cars, and we have put the cost of those cameras in the bucket and that sort.

>> Michael Grant:
And basically a data gathering exercise to in fact better determine whether it's occurring or whether it's not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
That's right. That's right. And you know, I've worked, you know, when I was attorney general, I had every law enforcement agency in the state, police department, Sheriff's Offices, every single one signed a proclamation opposing racial profiling and agreeing to adopt procedures of protocols to prevent it, to have training, to have early alert systems if it's starting to happen and really what the DPS settlement represents is an bodiment of the protocol signed a couple of years ago.

>> Michael Grant:
I will admit my eyebrows raised just a little bit when I read the story this week that you had joined with several other states in filing an amicus cury brief in support of the state of Texas and its defense of the 10 commandments at the State Capitol in Austin.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Right, well, I opposed removal of the 10 commandments last summer. I looked at the whole situation, looked at the placement on the monument on the plaza grounds. Until somebody raised it, I've been walking around those grounds for years, I deny know it was there. It's pretty --

>> Michael Grant:
I didn't know it was there.

>> Janet Napolitano:
It's pretty hidden. And it seemed to me that that is not really fairly a government endorsement of religion, and so, I joined with other states and I think Terry Goddard joined on another brief.

>> Michael Grant:
I understand, in fact, that the situation in Austin is very similar to our situation, where it is merely one thing in a collection of different things. There is one other state -- I want to say two cases are before the Supreme Court and there's another state case where the Ten Commandments are featured more prominently. Would you view it differently if it was -- I don't know, where the statue of Frank Luke is, and was sort of prominently centrally featured?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I'm not sure that that is so important. I mean, I think you know, you had the case last year in Alabama had it right there in a big tablet in the court building where people are coming in.

>> Michael Grant:
Right.

>> Janet Napolitano:
There are lines that move from simply having it be part of many illustrations of many things that have contributed to our culture and our heritage making versus making it the sole one. It's one of many such monuments out there and I think appropriately so, but you start moving it into the -- in the courthouse and so forth, that you've got a different dynamic.

>> Michael Grant:
Let me turn to some legislative issues. Carolyn Allen is backing a bill that would boost nurses' training, provide additional funds over a four-year time frame? What do you think about that concept?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I think the concept is very good. I think all of these bills that have budget implications, we need to look at them in the context of a whole budget. We have to deliver a balanced product at the end, and we need more nurses. We also need more child care. We also need more care for AHCCCS patients. We also need more, you know, correction officers for our prison inmates. There are a lot of compelling needs in the budget, but she's got her finger on a healthcare need that we have been working on the last couple of years. In fact, just adopted a five-year strategic plan to have more nurses educated in Arizona.

>> Michael Grant:
As you pointed out, I mean, healthcare is one of the large issues, so I assume you would be somewhat favorably disposed to -- again, I was at -- was it a $10 million price tag?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I think it was $20.

>> Michael Grant:
Over four years?

>> Janet Napolitano:
So the principle in the bill is a good one, but all of these money bills coming through individually need, you know, at some point we need to stop and say, okay, let's put them all on the table, let's put all of the cards out and see how much we can do on each thing to make the best balanced judgments, otherwised you end up with a situation if that bill comes out first it gets fully fund and something else which may be an equally compelling need because it came at the end of the session, all of a sudden there is no money left. So the money decisions I think have to wait until the end.

>> Michael Grant:
Okay. A proposal time pound the car if you are involved in an accident and don't have insurance coverage. Obviously uninsured motorists create a lot of havoc and damage, those sorts of things if that. Is that a good concept or not?

>> Janet Napolitano: Don't know. I haven't seen that bill. The only thing I've seen is an article in the paper about it, so I'm going to wait and see whether that moves through and if so, what kind of testimony is received in terms of would that really help us with the problem of the uninsured driver. We have too many uninsured drivers on our roads. When you are in an accident and you are paying for insurance and the person who caused the accident doesn't that is a frustrating situation to be in, but the question is, would this mechanism really help that problem?

>> Michael Grant:
Okay. Let me see, let me move to a couple of things -- oh, yeah, the film commission thing.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Right.

>> Michael Grant:
Did you get to meet Leslie Neilson or not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I have not, but I met Rick Schroeder who will be an important part of it.

>> Michael Grant:
Didn't he do a boxing movie here in Arizona in the past year or so?

>> Janet Napolitano:
He may have. He just direct aid movie that was set in Indian country that was opened, I think, in Scottsdale or something last year. So he's been active here and he really wants Arizona to be more active in the film area, film and television production. I think we can be. I think there is some very good things we can do. We have a great setting for film and television production and it all creates jobs. So we took what had been a defunct commission. We reappointed it, reinvigorated and and we're going to go about.

>> Michael Grant:
I didn't realize it was defunct. When did that happen?

>> Janet Napolitano:
In the last couple of years in Governor Hull's term, when the budget was bad, certain things had to go, and that was one. Now we're not quite in that situation, and we can begin to relook and retool. In this area, what we're really just talking about is bringing in new money to Arizona. We're talking about new businesses, new jobs, and, you know, very clean industry, one that people like. It's fun to have celebrities coming in and out and to see your state on a movie screen or television program. We're going to get into it.

>> Michael Grant:
In fact, I was talking to a friend who had just been to Palm Springs, Barry man any low is in Palm Springs and sports bars are playing his songs just in case he walks in.

>> Janet Napolitano:
I'll have to stay away from Palm Springs.

>> Michael Grant:
You know, I am hoping, as I am sure you are, that maybe we aren't going to need many air tankers this summer -- knock on wood -- we've had more rain than we had had, but I know you were looking to see what is the air tanker situation and do we know whether they are available or not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Oh, it's not good. The Forest Service has really sat on its collective hands this year. We may have a delayed or shorter fire season than the last two years, but you can't, you know, you can't bet that we will.

>> Michael Grant:
Right.

>> Janet Napolitano:
And their current schedule, they are not even going to be letting requests for proposals for air tankers until may, which is well into the fire season in Arizona and New Mexico. So, I've written some fairly strong letters to the Forest Service and I've asked our congressional delegation to dive into this and say, look, you are just not taking care of business where forest firefighting is concerned and these air tankers are concerned with New Mexico, Arizona, the states that start fire seasons early. I was pleased to see that Jon Kyl set up a meeting with mark Ray to pursue this. This is something we have to work on collectively, but why the Forest Service has been so dilatory is beyond me.

>> Michael Grant:
As I say, we'll keep our fingers crossed that -- better to be --

>> Janet Napolitano:
we shouldn't be in a position of having to keep our fingers crossed. We talked last year with them and they were going to do fire plans, the states were going to be involved, we were going to make decision abouts equipment, and none of that has happened.

>> Michael Grant:
Governor Janet Napolitano, thank you very much.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Thank you.

>> Michael Grant:
Starting February 10th, the Arizona theater company will present a production based on plays by French playwright George Feydeau. "For better or worse" will make its debut at the Herberger Theater in downtown Phoenix. The adaption of two of Feydeau's most outrageous one-act comedies features the story of an unhinged wife and her husband's military contract for unbreakable chamber pots. Tonight, we give you a preview of the production. Producer Sooyeon Lee takes us backstage.

>>Actor:
A chamber pot, you compare your slop bucket to this? Your slop Puckett bucket is nothing but a slop bucket, a foul feted object meant to be hidden, not displayed.

>>Actor:
Whereas this --

>> Actor:
this a foul feted object meant to be hidden, not displayed.

>>Reporter:
The play takes place in Paris before World War II, but the story is something that most of us are familiar with. Marriage.

>> Actor:
It may be to you, to anyone else, to the layman --

>> Reporter:
the Arizona theater company presents "for better or worse," an adaptation of George Feydeau's play.

>>Actor:
It's the fruit of my labor, a true sampling of my wares. This is the thunder mouth.

>>Actress:
Thunder mouth?

>>Actor
Your sewage is our bread and butter.

>>Actor:
The play is about marriage, what it means to be in a relationship. I had someone the other night at a preview compare it to the Honeymooners in the way they related to each other.

>> Actor:
Any other questions?

>> Reporter:
Artistic director David Ira Goldstein.

>>David Ira Goldstein Feydeau:
It was probably the greatest French playwright after Molaire.

>>Reporter:
He wrote five one-act plays about mattrimoney and two of them are presented here.

>> David Ira Goldstein:
They are funny, but they are also a little bit nasty, and it's about the relationship between two people, and I think we recognize the sorts of games that they play.

>> Actress:
300,000 for chamber pots?

>> Actor:
Astonishing, I know, and yet, God and willing, it will happen.

>>Actress:
What kind of rubish is this?

>> Geoff Hoyle:
I play the role of one who is a porcelain manufacturer. So his main claim to fame is that he manufactures chamber pots. And the idea in the show is that he has got a contract or is hoping to get a contract to supply a chamber pot for each and every member of the French army. So that every soldier will have his own chamber pot with his name and serial number on it to prevent unauthorized use.

>>Actress:
What will they think of next?

>>Actor:
Result. Very soon they will award a contract to provide this new military apparatus and that's where I come in.

>>Reporter:
Born in Great Britain --

>>Geoff Hoyle:
I translated it from the French and adapted it. I translated five plays in total. They are five one-act plays, but they are quite full of text, so there is a lot of words, and then we con plated together two of them, so we made an evening by putting two of them together.

>>Actor:
I own the patent on unbreakable porcelain; right? If I get the commission to go with unbreakable porcelain, that's it. A deal sewn up and I'm rich!

>>Geoff Hoyle:
I have two minds. One is the actor's mind and one is the dramaist's mind. I have to throw away the dramativity's mind. I have to push him out of the door. Go away playwright, get out of the door, your time is done. You can't be tinkering in my head. And it's very difficult for me because I keep thinking, it would be batter better if I said -- oh, I'm acting. I can't think about that. I have to completely immerse myself as much as possible in the situation, in the role, but I have great actors with me who are fantastic to work with.

>>Actress:
Oh, no, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, I don't want to be the wife of the chamber pot man.

>> Actor:
You are not going to say that to me are you?

>> Actress:
I have nothing to say to you.

>> Actor:
Don't spoil this one for me, please.

>> Reporter:
Two years, went into producing the play.

>> Geoff Hoyle:
It's not like any play I've ever done. The fun thing about this project was taking something from scratch and giving it the time and space to become what it would become and something new and different, I think, rediscovery of a classic French farce from the turn of the century.

>>Geoff Hoyle:
What do I want the audience to get out of it? I want them to get a lot of laughter, a good night out. I have a fantasy that there are people sitting in the seats and they are a husband, wife, man/women, elbows him and says, you're just like that, and ten lines later, you mean, you're not like that? And so that they recognize themselves and there is a little bit an ew, this is a little bit -- whoa, this is very real, but it's so absurd and so pushed to the limit, that all you can do really is laugh at the absurdity of it.

>>Actor:
When he gets here, be cordial and polite.

>> Actress:
When am I impolite. I know how to behave in company.

>> Actor:
Yes, so after you go, give baby his laxative and get dressed!

>> Michael Grant:
You can check out a transcript of tonight's show, see what's coming up on "Horizon" at our web site, www.azpbs.org. When you get to the home page, scroll down, click on the word "Horizon."

>> Reporter:
State lawmakers are making progress on several bills, including one that would deal with Arizona's methamphetamine problem. The Arizona Department of Public Safety has settled a lawsuit against it claiming racial profiling. And the City of Phoenix is looking at cutting its budget. Topics on the Journalists' Roundtable, Friday at 7:00 on "Horizon."

>> Michael Grant:
Thanks for joining us this Thursday evening. I'm Michael Grant. Have a great one. Good night.

First Thursday: The Governor on HORIZON


  • The legislature is ramping up its effort at passing new laws. Horizon spoke to the Governor about the latest bills including one that would deal with Arizona's nursing shortage.
Guests:
  • Janet Napolitano - Arizona Governor


View Transcript
> Michael Grant:
Tonight on "Horizon," President Bush gave his state of the union speech last night. We'll get reaction from some members of our congressional delegation around our Governor. Plus, the legislature is ramping up its effort at passing new laws. We'll talk to the Governor about the latest bills including one that would deal with Arizona's nursing shortage. That's coming up next on "Horizon."

Announcer: "Horizon" is made possible by the friends of channel 8, members who provide financial support to this Arizona PBS station. Thank you.

>> Michael Grant: Good evening, I'm Michael Grant. In his state of the union speech last night, President Bush made his pitch for reforming Social Security. He also outlined other issues, including one of great interest to Arizonans, immigration reform. We'll talk to Governor Janet Napolitano on "First Thursday, the Governor on Horizon," about the president's address and also about state issues, but first, here is reaction from two of our state's congressional delegation on the president's speech.

>>Sen. Jon Kyl:
What you see it what you get. What he campaigned on are the same themes you saw in the speech. The concept of liberty abroad, the fact that prepare is on the march and that he wanted to do what he could do to promote that, and then here at home, the themes that he campaigned on to ensure that our younger generation would have Social Security to count on when they get ready to retire. Obviously, the front and centerpiece of the talk tonight. But also other issues like the tax reform, making his tax cuts permanent, immigration reform, important to Arizona, and the other issues that he campaigned on, making sure we can get the judges that he nominates confirmed. All of these are important items. I'm glad he brought them up. Well tonight he certainly got more detailed about his proposal, including the personal accounts. I think most people, particularly younger people in this country, understand the benefits of being able to invest some of this money in your own personal account, to be able to control that money, to have it grow as the value grows with any other investments, and to be able to count therefore on more money available at the time of your retirement than what Social Security is likely to provide. At least younger people can appreciate that. As the president noted, those nearing retirement are not going to be able to take advantage of that, but their Social Security isn't going to be changed in any way. Their benefits are guaranteed. I should say our benefits now. But younger people would have a lot more opportunity in this country to own their own personal account if the president's plan can be adopted.

>>Rep. Ed Pastor:
The president tonight gave us a rosy picture, but the reality is, we're at war. 1400 men and women have given their lives. 10,000 people are in the hospital with their wounds. He talks about giving programs to Americans, but what he doesn't say is that he will not do anything about reducing the tax break and again talks about cutting programs. 150 programs he's going cut. How is he going to give a PELL grant increase when there is no money? He talks about Social Security and what a crisis it is. The reality is, there is no crisis. The crisis in America today is the lack of health insurance for 43 million people. He should have spoken on that today and what is he going to do to give affordable health insurance not only to our children but to our grandchildren. The state of the state is not that rosy.

>> Michael Grant:
Here now is Governor Janet Napolitano.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Next week I'm doing a guest coach stint there partnership did the U of A women's team. We lost in overtime, but it was a lot of fun.

>> Michael Grant:
You are 4 and 2 because you are temporary coach for the mercury a couple of times.

>> Janet Napolitano:
The mercury, sun devils and wildcats. It's fun to sit on the bench and act like I know something.

>> Michael Grant:
Are you plugging for like a third career.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Who knows when you are going to need another day job.

>> Michael Grant:
I think the lakers may have an opening for you.

>> Janet Napolitano:
I hear they may have a vacancy. I'm sure they'll call.

>> Michael Grant:
You are two out of three. I want to talk about a couple of the state of the union subjects. Let me get your overall reaction to the speech where you obviously just heard from Senator Kyl and congressman pastor.

>> Janet Napolitano:
On a technical matter, I thought it was very well done. I thought it was well-written, very well constructed speech. I thought the president delivered it well. He's clearly gotten better at this sort of thing as time has gone on. And the moment at the end of the speech when the mother of the marine who died in the battle of Fallujah and the daughter of the man who had been killed by Saddam, hugged, you know, there are moments that transcend politics and that trans-sends speech-making quite frankly and that was one of those moments.

>> Michael Grant:
The president obviously focused mostly on Social Security. He did touch on immigration reform, again, not giving very many specifics, but I think saying something like, we need to reform immigration to allow business to hire workers for jobs that Americans do not want. I know we've talked about this subject before. You generally favor a guest worker-type program, do you not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Yes, I do. I think it's a necessary change in our immigration laws, and I actually think Arizona is really bearing the burden of a federal immigration law now that simply doesn't work. You know, it has fostered chaos along the border, and we're a border state, and we experience that more so than other states. I was glad to seat president include at least a mention of it in his state of the union.

>> Michael Grant:
Let me avoid the term "amnesty" because I think it carries a lot of baggage with it.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Right.

>> Michael Grant:
Let me describe it more in these terms. Some people say, well, listen, if you are here illegally, a program should give you the opportunity to go ahead and work toward legalizing your status. Some might call that amnesty, others would term it other things. Should that be a component of this package or not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Well, I think you can't do a guest worker program without considering those who are already here and those who are yet to come. When you think of those who are already in the country illegally, you have different categories. You have people who have been living in this country illegally for 20, 30, 40 years, paying taxes, never broken any law, been working the whole time. You have children who have been either brought here as babies or as young children who have grown up here. Shouldn't they have a chance? They didn't come over here over their own volition. Shouldn't they have a chance for citizenship? And then you have those who have just recently immigrated in the last year or two. It seems to me as the Congress takes this up, they ought to consider different people in different categories separately. They are not all the same.

>> Michael Grant:
What about the argument, though, that, yeah, but if you allow people to do that, you really invite the next set of people to violate whatever new policy you have.

>> Janet Napolitano:
That's why you can't do a blanket amnesty. That's why you can't do something that is a cookie-cutter approach to the whole group. But I think you can divide into certain subgroups and make logical decisions. The plain fact of the matter is that people from Mexico have been coming to this country, not because they can become citizens, but because they can get jobs, and they don't have a similar job market in Mexico.

>> Michael Grant:
Right.

>> Janet Napolitano:

It's primarily an economic immigration.

>> Michael Grant:
Final question on this subject. Congressman Flake indicated that he may be a couple, three weeks away from dropping the legislation in congress that he has been working on, apparently with congressman Kolbe and also Senator MCCain. Have you gotten any kind of preview on what that's going to look like?

>> Janet Napolitano:
No, I haven't. I know the three of them had been working, and others on the hill have been working, and really, if we're going to get any federal immigration reform, it has to be led by the president and it really needs to be led this year an off-election year. I'm very much in favor of our delegation moving forward on this. , as I've said many times, one of the things I think Prop 200 represented was the frustration of Arizonans that nobody was really taking up the problem of the border and the federal immigration and that needs to be done and it should be done now.

>> Michael Grant:
Privatize at least part of Social Security?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Well, you know, if I had to pick a domestic crisis, I'd have to say I wouldn't have picked Social Security. Sure there are changes that is can and should be made, but people have been predicting the demise of Social Security since it was originally enacted. And you know, I would have to say we're -- where I'm sitting dealing with AHCCCS, where we've got a million people in Arizona on Medicaid dealing with another million Arizonans who have no health insurance, healthcare to me is really in a crisis and it's a train wreck getting ready to happen. I didn't hear enough from the president on that. And we're going to have to wait for his budget to see -- you know, this transition on Social Security, one thing he didn't talk about was the billions of dollars that will cost in transition costs, and how that's going to be paid for. Well, you either have to increase our already too-large deficit or you have to cut domestic spending somewhere else. Where is it going to come from? Medicare? Medicaid? Until those choices become transparent, I don't think we can fairly judge the president's proposal.

>> Michael Grant:
With boomers retiring, though, the numbers do start getting kind of difficult around 2020. I'm not predicting the imminent collapse of Social Security --

>> Janet Napolitano:
I wouldn't even agree with you there. I've seen numbers that say that up to the year 2042, the system can continue to pay out at the same level.

>> Michael Grant:
Assuming the taxpayer can pay back the IOUs sitting in the account.

>> Janet Napolitano:
But really, you're talking, you know, like -- I think the central point is what is our key domestic -- what is the domestic crisis that is affecting everybody the most right now, that we really need to take up? Now, did you hear anything at all about Social Security during the presidential campaign? No. It wasn't talked about. What was talked about? What was talked about is what is really on people's minds, Iraq and healthcare.

>> Michael Grant:
Uh-huh.

>> Janet Napolitano:
We've got a lot of Iraq in the speech last night, and I thought we should have and it was appropriately addressed. We didn't hear enough about healthcare.

>> Michael Grant:
On the other hand, pretty much a bi-partisan effort in the mid-198os looked at Social Security and said listen, we need to do something to it to put it back on an even keel and people made tough decisions back then.

>> Janet Napolitano:
I'm not saying you shouldn't look at Social Security, what I'm suggesting is to make it the top and basically the only new domestic issue, the fight in congress, I think it's the wrong fight. I think the fight is about healthcare.

>> Michael Grant:
All right. What about the settlement that DPS entered into on the allegations of racial profiling?

>> Janet Napolitano:
This was a case that arose several years ago involving stops along I-40 outside of Flagstaff. The Department of Public Safety without saying whether there was or wasn't racial profiling, we said look what's put into play better procedures and things so that we don't get into the trap of having racial profiling. So the settlement involves better record-keeping. It involves cameras in cars, and we have put the cost of those cameras in the bucket and that sort.

>> Michael Grant:
And basically a data gathering exercise to in fact better determine whether it's occurring or whether it's not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
That's right. That's right. And you know, I've worked, you know, when I was attorney general, I had every law enforcement agency in the state, police department, Sheriff's Offices, every single one signed a proclamation opposing racial profiling and agreeing to adopt procedures of protocols to prevent it, to have training, to have early alert systems if it's starting to happen and really what the DPS settlement represents is an bodiment of the protocol signed a couple of years ago.

>> Michael Grant:
I will admit my eyebrows raised just a little bit when I read the story this week that you had joined with several other states in filing an amicus cury brief in support of the state of Texas and its defense of the 10 commandments at the State Capitol in Austin.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Right, well, I opposed removal of the 10 commandments last summer. I looked at the whole situation, looked at the placement on the monument on the plaza grounds. Until somebody raised it, I've been walking around those grounds for years, I deny know it was there. It's pretty --

>> Michael Grant:
I didn't know it was there.

>> Janet Napolitano:
It's pretty hidden. And it seemed to me that that is not really fairly a government endorsement of religion, and so, I joined with other states and I think Terry Goddard joined on another brief.

>> Michael Grant:
I understand, in fact, that the situation in Austin is very similar to our situation, where it is merely one thing in a collection of different things. There is one other state -- I want to say two cases are before the Supreme Court and there's another state case where the Ten Commandments are featured more prominently. Would you view it differently if it was -- I don't know, where the statue of Frank Luke is, and was sort of prominently centrally featured?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I'm not sure that that is so important. I mean, I think you know, you had the case last year in Alabama had it right there in a big tablet in the court building where people are coming in.

>> Michael Grant:
Right.

>> Janet Napolitano:
There are lines that move from simply having it be part of many illustrations of many things that have contributed to our culture and our heritage making versus making it the sole one. It's one of many such monuments out there and I think appropriately so, but you start moving it into the -- in the courthouse and so forth, that you've got a different dynamic.

>> Michael Grant:
Let me turn to some legislative issues. Carolyn Allen is backing a bill that would boost nurses' training, provide additional funds over a four-year time frame? What do you think about that concept?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I think the concept is very good. I think all of these bills that have budget implications, we need to look at them in the context of a whole budget. We have to deliver a balanced product at the end, and we need more nurses. We also need more child care. We also need more care for AHCCCS patients. We also need more, you know, correction officers for our prison inmates. There are a lot of compelling needs in the budget, but she's got her finger on a healthcare need that we have been working on the last couple of years. In fact, just adopted a five-year strategic plan to have more nurses educated in Arizona.

>> Michael Grant:
As you pointed out, I mean, healthcare is one of the large issues, so I assume you would be somewhat favorably disposed to -- again, I was at -- was it a $10 million price tag?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I think it was $20.

>> Michael Grant:
Over four years?

>> Janet Napolitano:
So the principle in the bill is a good one, but all of these money bills coming through individually need, you know, at some point we need to stop and say, okay, let's put them all on the table, let's put all of the cards out and see how much we can do on each thing to make the best balanced judgments, otherwised you end up with a situation if that bill comes out first it gets fully fund and something else which may be an equally compelling need because it came at the end of the session, all of a sudden there is no money left. So the money decisions I think have to wait until the end.

>> Michael Grant:
Okay. A proposal time pound the car if you are involved in an accident and don't have insurance coverage. Obviously uninsured motorists create a lot of havoc and damage, those sorts of things if that. Is that a good concept or not?

>> Janet Napolitano: Don't know. I haven't seen that bill. The only thing I've seen is an article in the paper about it, so I'm going to wait and see whether that moves through and if so, what kind of testimony is received in terms of would that really help us with the problem of the uninsured driver. We have too many uninsured drivers on our roads. When you are in an accident and you are paying for insurance and the person who caused the accident doesn't that is a frustrating situation to be in, but the question is, would this mechanism really help that problem?

>> Michael Grant:
Okay. Let me see, let me move to a couple of things -- oh, yeah, the film commission thing.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Right.

>> Michael Grant:
Did you get to meet Leslie Neilson or not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
I have not, but I met Rick Schroeder who will be an important part of it.

>> Michael Grant:
Didn't he do a boxing movie here in Arizona in the past year or so?

>> Janet Napolitano:
He may have. He just direct aid movie that was set in Indian country that was opened, I think, in Scottsdale or something last year. So he's been active here and he really wants Arizona to be more active in the film area, film and television production. I think we can be. I think there is some very good things we can do. We have a great setting for film and television production and it all creates jobs. So we took what had been a defunct commission. We reappointed it, reinvigorated and and we're going to go about.

>> Michael Grant:
I didn't realize it was defunct. When did that happen?

>> Janet Napolitano:
In the last couple of years in Governor Hull's term, when the budget was bad, certain things had to go, and that was one. Now we're not quite in that situation, and we can begin to relook and retool. In this area, what we're really just talking about is bringing in new money to Arizona. We're talking about new businesses, new jobs, and, you know, very clean industry, one that people like. It's fun to have celebrities coming in and out and to see your state on a movie screen or television program. We're going to get into it.

>> Michael Grant:
In fact, I was talking to a friend who had just been to Palm Springs, Barry man any low is in Palm Springs and sports bars are playing his songs just in case he walks in.

>> Janet Napolitano:
I'll have to stay away from Palm Springs.

>> Michael Grant:
You know, I am hoping, as I am sure you are, that maybe we aren't going to need many air tankers this summer -- knock on wood -- we've had more rain than we had had, but I know you were looking to see what is the air tanker situation and do we know whether they are available or not?

>> Janet Napolitano:
Oh, it's not good. The Forest Service has really sat on its collective hands this year. We may have a delayed or shorter fire season than the last two years, but you can't, you know, you can't bet that we will.

>> Michael Grant:
Right.

>> Janet Napolitano:
And their current schedule, they are not even going to be letting requests for proposals for air tankers until may, which is well into the fire season in Arizona and New Mexico. So, I've written some fairly strong letters to the Forest Service and I've asked our congressional delegation to dive into this and say, look, you are just not taking care of business where forest firefighting is concerned and these air tankers are concerned with New Mexico, Arizona, the states that start fire seasons early. I was pleased to see that Jon Kyl set up a meeting with mark Ray to pursue this. This is something we have to work on collectively, but why the Forest Service has been so dilatory is beyond me.

>> Michael Grant:
As I say, we'll keep our fingers crossed that -- better to be --

>> Janet Napolitano:
we shouldn't be in a position of having to keep our fingers crossed. We talked last year with them and they were going to do fire plans, the states were going to be involved, we were going to make decision abouts equipment, and none of that has happened.

>> Michael Grant:
Governor Janet Napolitano, thank you very much.

>> Janet Napolitano:
Thank you.

>> Michael Grant:
Starting February 10th, the Arizona theater company will present a production based on plays by French playwright George Feydeau. "For better or worse" will make its debut at the Herberger Theater in downtown Phoenix. The adaption of two of Feydeau's most outrageous one-act comedies features the story of an unhinged wife and her husband's military contract for unbreakable chamber pots. Tonight, we give you a preview of the production. Producer Sooyeon Lee takes us backstage.

>>Actor:
A chamber pot, you compare your slop bucket to this? Your slop Puckett bucket is nothing but a slop bucket, a foul feted object meant to be hidden, not displayed.

>>Actor:
Whereas this --

>> Actor:
this a foul feted object meant to be hidden, not displayed.

>>Reporter:
The play takes place in Paris before World War II, but the story is something that most of us are familiar with. Marriage.

>> Actor:
It may be to you, to anyone else, to the layman --

>> Reporter:
the Arizona theater company presents "for better or worse," an adaptation of George Feydeau's play.

>>Actor:
It's the fruit of my labor, a true sampling of my wares. This is the thunder mouth.

>>Actress:
Thunder mouth?

>>Actor
Your sewage is our bread and butter.

>>Actor:
The play is about marriage, what it means to be in a relationship. I had someone the other night at a preview compare it to the Honeymooners in the way they related to each other.

>> Actor:
Any other questions?

>> Reporter:
Artistic director David Ira Goldstein.

>>David Ira Goldstein Feydeau:
It was probably the greatest French playwright after Molaire.

>>Reporter:
He wrote five one-act plays about mattrimoney and two of them are presented here.

>> David Ira Goldstein:
They are funny, but they are also a little bit nasty, and it's about the relationship between two people, and I think we recognize the sorts of games that they play.

>> Actress:
300,000 for chamber pots?

>> Actor:
Astonishing, I know, and yet, God and willing, it will happen.

>>Actress:
What kind of rubish is this?

>> Geoff Hoyle:
I play the role of one who is a porcelain manufacturer. So his main claim to fame is that he manufactures chamber pots. And the idea in the show is that he has got a contract or is hoping to get a contract to supply a chamber pot for each and every member of the French army. So that every soldier will have his own chamber pot with his name and serial number on it to prevent unauthorized use.

>>Actress:
What will they think of next?

>>Actor:
Result. Very soon they will award a contract to provide this new military apparatus and that's where I come in.

>>Reporter:
Born in Great Britain --

>>Geoff Hoyle:
I translated it from the French and adapted it. I translated five plays in total. They are five one-act plays, but they are quite full of text, so there is a lot of words, and then we con plated together two of them, so we made an evening by putting two of them together.

>>Actor:
I own the patent on unbreakable porcelain; right? If I get the commission to go with unbreakable porcelain, that's it. A deal sewn up and I'm rich!

>>Geoff Hoyle:
I have two minds. One is the actor's mind and one is the dramaist's mind. I have to throw away the dramativity's mind. I have to push him out of the door. Go away playwright, get out of the door, your time is done. You can't be tinkering in my head. And it's very difficult for me because I keep thinking, it would be batter better if I said -- oh, I'm acting. I can't think about that. I have to completely immerse myself as much as possible in the situation, in the role, but I have great actors with me who are fantastic to work with.

>>Actress:
Oh, no, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, I don't want to be the wife of the chamber pot man.

>> Actor:
You are not going to say that to me are you?

>> Actress:
I have nothing to say to you.

>> Actor:
Don't spoil this one for me, please.

>> Reporter:
Two years, went into producing the play.

>> Geoff Hoyle:
It's not like any play I've ever done. The fun thing about this project was taking something from scratch and giving it the time and space to become what it would become and something new and different, I think, rediscovery of a classic French farce from the turn of the century.

>>Geoff Hoyle:
What do I want the audience to get out of it? I want them to get a lot of laughter, a good night out. I have a fantasy that there are people sitting in the seats and they are a husband, wife, man/women, elbows him and says, you're just like that, and ten lines later, you mean, you're not like that? And so that they recognize themselves and there is a little bit an ew, this is a little bit -- whoa, this is very real, but it's so absurd and so pushed to the limit, that all you can do really is laugh at the absurdity of it.

>>Actor:
When he gets here, be cordial and polite.

>> Actress:
When am I impolite. I know how to behave in company.

>> Actor:
Yes, so after you go, give baby his laxative and get dressed!

>> Michael Grant:
You can check out a transcript of tonight's show, see what's coming up on "Horizon" at our web site, www.azpbs.org. When you get to the home page, scroll down, click on the word "Horizon."

>> Reporter:
State lawmakers are making progress on several bills, including one that would deal with Arizona's methamphetamine problem. The Arizona Department of Public Safety has settled a lawsuit against it claiming racial profiling. And the City of Phoenix is looking at cutting its budget. Topics on the Journalists' Roundtable, Friday at 7:00 on "Horizon."

>> Michael Grant:
Thanks for joining us this Thursday evening. I'm Michael Grant. Have a great one. Good night.

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